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Forum » Im balls deep in this Shakespeare conspiracy theory
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Thread: Im balls deep in this Shakespeare conspiracy theory

post 1636816263 04-22-2021, 05:43 AM
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Im balls deep in this Shakespeare conspiracy theory

Well, the only conspiracy theory really is that William Shakspeare from Stratford Upon Avon is the real author.

There is more evidence that Edward de Vere, the 17th Earl of Oxford, was the true author. The work of Shakespeare is basically an autobiography of de Vere.

In fact, there is not a SINGLE piece of evidence from his lifetime that even suggests the man from Stratford ever wrote a single line of anything, let along the best literary works of all time.

brb countless letters, contemporary accounts, journals, wills with manuscripts, ect for other playwrights of the time but ZERO for Shakespeare. Not one account of anyone ever even acknowledging him as a writer. Theres accounts of him being referred to as a theater investor, and a litany of odd jobs, but never once a writer.

His own daughter was illiterate, as were his parents. The most literate person to ever walk the planet had an illiterate child, lol.

Its a very interesting topic and id be happy to discuss it and take questions
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post 1636816523 04-22-2021, 05:52 AM
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post 1636816623 04-22-2021, 05:54 AM
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Is there any documentary about this? (Srs)
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post 1636816663 04-22-2021, 05:55 AM
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ive heard francis bacon is shakespeare and that he wrote the KJV bible. never heard of this one
post 1636816673 04-22-2021, 05:55 AM
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Originally Posted By Brosnbroccoli⏩
Is there any documentary about this? (Srs)
There’s a Hollywood film. I forget the name of it
post 1636816733 04-22-2021, 05:56 AM
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I go down this rabbit hole every once in a while. It's very compelling.
post 1636817723 04-22-2021, 06:20 AM
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There's a lot of interesting data to debate on this

https://doubtaboutwill.org/
post 1636817973 04-22-2021, 06:27 AM
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Unaware, but I could see it.

A nobleman like an Earl would be highly educated vs. most people at that time and might want to remain anonymous as the theater wasn't exactly respectable. And for the "producer" of the work to be credited by having his name attached makes perfect sense.
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post 1636818273 04-22-2021, 06:33 AM
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Originally Posted By davik⏩
ive heard francis bacon is shakespeare and that he wrote the KJV bible. never heard of this one
Francis Bacon is the 2nd leading contender. He appears a lot in hidden code and numerology. He was a mason and masons in that time period were balls deep in codes.

The most compelling case is de Vere though. Hamlet is captured by pirates and left nude on the shores of Denmark. that literally happened to de Vere, except the shores of England. Polonious is also a satire of his own step father. But also de Vere can be placed in all the locations that the real Shakespeare would have needed to be in the write some of these places, like Venice.
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post 1636818523 04-22-2021, 06:38 AM
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Originally Posted By katya422⏩
Unaware, but I could see it.

A nobleman like an Earl would be highly educated vs. most people at that time and might want to remain anonymous as the theater wasn't exactly respectable. And for the "producer" of the work to be credited by having his name attached makes perfect sense.
the plays also contain countless satires of people of the english court, including Queen Mary and Henry the 8th and many oeople directly in de Veree close circle
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post 1636818733 04-22-2021, 06:42 AM
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Good luck, we're all counting on you.

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post 1636818773 04-22-2021, 06:42 AM
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I am a fan of this theory. Following the lack of money and the lack of rights his family had to his writings was interesting and compelling.
post 1636818943 04-22-2021, 06:45 AM
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Originally Posted By davik⏩
ive heard francis bacon is shakespeare and that he wrote the KJV bible. never heard of this one
What ive read too 🤷‍♂️
post 1636818963 04-22-2021, 06:46 AM
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Pics of illiterate daughter?
post 1636819733 04-22-2021, 06:57 AM
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Originally Posted By Toker095⏩
Pics of illiterate daughter?
misc please never change
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post 1636820223 04-22-2021, 07:05 AM
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Well duhhh
post 1636820603 04-22-2021, 07:14 AM
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In on this thread to read later. I know almost nothing about this but it seems compelling.

But then, why would someone else allow Shakespeare to take all the credit for the work and attain the legendary status he has? Or is it just a case of the evidence from that time is too ropey to properly establish who was the author? How/why did shakespeare end up getting credit for the work if it wasn't his?
(Maybe an obvious question, as i said i don't know much about this, these are just the first questions that come to mind)

One thing I have also heard though is that Christopher Marlowe might have been responsible for some of Shakespeare's works after faking his death. I do live in Canterbury though where Marlowe is from, and where the Marlowe theatre is so it's possible it's just a local myth.. but i may as well add fuel to the fire :P

Where's the best place to find historical sources related to this?

Will rep when on recharge for making an actual intriguing thread.
post 1636821093 04-22-2021, 07:21 AM
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Those are certainely possible.
I have always been sceptical of the Bacon theory for one simple reason: The dude was a full time political figure, led multiple secret societies, already wrote dozens of philosophical works and died in his 60s. Where would he have fit a secret full time job as a playwright in?

The de Vere theory seems more legit though and basically impossible to disprove. In the end we know very little about Shakespear so it's possible.
Originally Posted By TappingTheZen⏩
In on this thread to read later. I know almost nothing about this but it seems compelling.

But then, why would someone else allow Shakespeare to take all the credit for the work and attain the legendary status he has? Or is it just a case of the evidence from that time is too ropey to properly establish who was the author? How/why did shakespeare end up getting credit for the work if it wasn't his?
(Maybe an obvious question, as i said i don't know much about this, these are just the first questions that come to mind)

Where's the best place to find historical sources related to this?
1) It was pretty common at that time for noblemen to write under pseudonyms.
2) He was successful while still alive, not revered.
post 1636821723 04-22-2021, 07:32 AM
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Originally Posted By I3igAl⏩
Those are certainely possible.
I have always been sceptical of the Bacon theory for one simple reason: The dude was a full time political figure, led multiple secret societies, already wrote dozens of philosophical works and died in his 60s. Where would he have fit a secret full time job as a playwright in?

The de Vere theory seems more legit though and basically impossible to disprove. In the end we know very little about Shakespear so it's possible.




1) It was pretty common at that time for noblemen to write under pseudonyms.
2) He was not that successful while still alive.
Ah yeah, to be honest i did kind of know this (that it was common to use pseudonyms) i just didn't think of it for some reason. But isn't a pseudonym just a fake name, wasn't shakespeare from Stratford actually a person who existed?

I don't know if you've seen Blackadder, but this reminds me of where Blackadder writes a butlers tale under a female pseudonym 'Gertrude Perkins' cos 'everyone is doing it' lol. I can't find a clip of it on youtube, but this is from the same episode and still funny


I forgot about this one too but it made me LOL
post 1636821853 04-22-2021, 07:35 AM
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Originally Posted By LethalGunz34⏩
Good luck, we’re all counting on you.

Lmfao this
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post 1636822423 04-22-2021, 07:43 AM
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Riveting tale ole Chap srs
post 1636823083 04-22-2021, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted By TappingTheZen⏩
Ah yeah, to be honest i did kind of know this (that it was common to use pseudonyms) i just didn't think of it for some reason. But isn't a pseudonym just a fake name, wasn't shakespeare from Stratford actually a person who existed?

I don't know if you've seen Blackadder, but this reminds me of where Blackadder writes a butlers tale under a female pseudonym 'Gertrude Perkins' cos 'everyone is doing it' lol. I can't find a clip of it on youtube, but this is from the same episode and still funny


I forgot about this one too but it made me LOL
I only watched the first two season and stopped during third season, because I didn't know enough about the British courts during the era it took place to truly enjoy all these gags about George IV being an imbecile.
post 1636823473 04-22-2021, 07:57 AM
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Originally Posted By Toker095⏩
Pics of illiterate daughter?
do not read my posts and weep, i am not there i do not sleep
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post 1636824353 04-22-2021, 08:10 AM
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Originally Posted By TappingTheZen⏩
In on this thread to read later. I know almost nothing about this but it seems compelling.

But then, why would someone else allow Shakespeare to take all the credit for the work and attain the legendary status he has? Or is it just a case of the evidence from that time is too ropey to properly establish who was the author? How/why did shakespeare end up getting credit for the work if it wasn't his?
(Maybe an obvious question, as i said i don't know much about this, these are just the first questions that come to mind)

One thing I have also heard though is that Christopher Marlowe might have been responsible for some of Shakespeare's works after faking his death. I do live in Canterbury though where Marlowe is from, and where the Marlowe theatre is so it's possible it's just a local myth.. but i may as well add fuel to the fire :P

Where's the best place to find historical sources related to this?

Will rep when on recharge for making an actual intriguing thread.
To your first point: Why would someone allow another man to become a legend off of their own work?

Shakespeare actually didnt acquire his status until after he died. But as for de Vere, its known as the stigma of print. Writing a play or a novel was considered a “commercial” endeavor and beneath that of s Gentleman. It would stain a families reputation. But there is also another nugget about this.

de Vere was giving a 1,000pound per year annuity directly from the queen for “secret” services. 1,000pounds per year was an absurd amount of cash back then. The main theory behind that was that he was paid by the queen herself to write plays in the language of the court to bring a level of sophistication and pride to the population of england. it was a service for the country. Thus, choosing a country bumpkin like Shakspeare (yes without the “e” after the k since thats how the man from Straford spelled his name) would have been a great person to give credit to. Not only was he already a financier of the theater but it would show the people that any of them could be the next great playwright.

Also, as i said before, a ton of whats in the plays are obvious satires of members of the court. de Vere used it to talk chit about the people he knew without getting in trouble for it.
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post 1636824433 04-22-2021, 08:11 AM
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As for Marlow, he has long been a suspect but other more promising contenders have surfaced, mostly de Vere.

Historical sources? Well theres NOTHING that even remotely suggests Shakspeare ever wrote a single line of text. In fact theres tons of evidence showing all his other lines of work but nothing about being a writer.

You can also checkout the youtube channel Shakespeare Authorship Trust for all the evidence for de Vere. There are quite a few famous and prominent people that believe it was de Vere, including Mark Twain and 5 different US Supreme Court justices. The first ever recorded instance of the authorship being questioned popped up as early as the early 1700’s
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post 1636824543 04-22-2021, 08:13 AM
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Spoiler!


I think this CT is pretty interdasting. It seems highly unlikely that a literary scholar like WS would not educate his own kid to read.. then again he could have been a severe autist for reading and not cared about anything else. I like the de Vere theory, attributing to WS through an alliance of sorts.
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post 1636824913 04-22-2021, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted By TappingTheZen⏩
Ah yeah, to be honest i did kind of know this (that it was common to use pseudonyms) i just didn't think of it for some reason. But isn't a pseudonym just a fake name, wasn't shakespeare from Stratford actually a person who existed?
]
yes he existed and we know about all of his endeavors EXCEPT writing. Hes never once directly referred to as a writer until like 10 years after he died.

No manuscripts left to his family in his will, no letters that he ever wrote have ever been found (but many letters from all the other prominent writers of his time exist), no diary entries or letters ir anything from any family members that even hint at him being a writer. nothing from residents of Stratford or mayne an old teacher or something. You are married to, the daughter of, the neighbor of, the former grammer teacher of the greatest writer to ever live and no one ever mentions it at all?

We have court documents, wills, business contracts, ect for the man from Stratford but nothing that even hints at him being a writer. But plenty that shows he was a businessman, a financier, small time actor, ect.

In fact, there are numerous plays that were performed and published that have his name on the title page that we are 100% sure was not written by him, including “The Tragedy of Yorkshire”
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post 1636825253 04-22-2021, 08:25 AM
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I enjoyed learning about the Edward de Vere theory too.

I figure de Vere would be known as the author of the famous plays today if the current big businesses of promoting William Shakespeare didn't make so much money.
post 1636825303 04-22-2021, 08:26 AM
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Originally Posted By eatmycrackers⏩
Good luck OP we are all counting on you
Spoiler!


I think this CT is pretty interdasting. It seems highly unlikely that a literary scholar like WS would not educate his own kid to read.. then again he could have been a severe autist for reading and not cared about anything else. I like the de Vere theory, attributing to WS through an alliance of sorts.
he owned no books. in fact we know that his daughters library, after he died, consisted of books her father-in-law handed down to her. But nothing that her own father handed down to her. He gave his daughter everything in the will, except the “2nd best bed” of which went to his wife. ****ing lol

theres not even any records that indicate he had any education at all. We are talking about a man that would have had to have had a world class education, been fluent in Latin and French, have intricate and extensive knowledge of daily life at court (not only in english court but french and italian court as well), have physically been all over Italy and in specific areas of italy at the same specific times as de Vere is documented to have been.

The greatest writer of all time is not only never referred to as a writer by his contemporaries, theres isnt even an example of his own writing.
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post 1636825433 04-22-2021, 08:28 AM
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Originally Posted By ParsleyTea⏩
I enjoyed learning about the Edward de Vere theory too.

I figure de Vere would be known as the author of the famous plays today if the current big businesses of promoting William Shakespeare didn't make so much money.
the Shakespeare Birthplace Trust makes a killing off of tourism...in a house that didnt even exist at the time of Shakespeares life
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