Wat? Disney have 4% of US GDP in losses?

Ok, here are the Disney releases this year. I won't go into too much detail with the made for Disney+ stuff. Disney+ is overall losing money. I am going to list the Walt Disney Pictures, Marvel Studios and Lucasfilm. They did have other shared properties with other studios, honestly nothing major, but I won't list them (most seem to have been pushed to Disney+ and Hulu at the same tim)

Feb 17th: Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania.

March 10th: Chang Can Dunk. Disney+

April 28: Peter Pan & Wendy. Disney+

May 5: Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3. Marvel.

May 26th: The Little Mermaid.

June 16: Elemental.

June 30: Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny.

July 28: Haunted Mansion.

November 10: The Marvels.

November 22: Wish.

So, we're talking about Antman, GotG3, Little Mermaid, Elemental, Indy V, Marvels and Wish primarily. I will bring up Peter Pan and Wendy. Originally it was supposed to be a theatrical release and they put $170,000,000 into it but based on poor test screening dumped it onto Disney+.

I'm going with the x2.5 budget to break even. We just assume the marketing was halfish budget and aren't going to get into the weeds with nitty gritty details about Domestic gross being > International. Keeping it simple. With Wish and the Marvels, I'm going to extrapolate and guess their WW as they're still in theaters.

Antman: Budget $200M. Gross: 476WW. Failure
GotG3: Budget $250M. Gross: 845WW. Success
The Little Mermaid: Budget (likely over) $250M. Gross: 570WW. Failure
Elemental: Budget 200M. Gross: 495M. Failure
Indy V: Budget 300M. Gross: 384WW. Bomb
Haunted Mansion: Budget 150M. Gross: 117WW. Bomb.
The Marvels*: Budget: ~225M (w/ breaks). Gross Est: 220WW. Bomb.
Wish*: Budget 200M. Gross Est: 115-150M. Bomb

So, that's a lotta failures and bombs. Taking a harder look at one, let's look at Antman: a ~300M budget and marketing. Made roughly half of 476 in theaters so it lost ~60 million in theaters, recouped somewhat with DVD/Bluray sales and the streaming rights, ones here sold to Disney+ (which is losing massive money). We aren't really privy to those numbers but we do know that DVD/Bluray sales are almost non-existent in 2023 and it's all about streaming.

Another hard to swallow example would be The Marvels. Original budget was a reported 275M, although word is closer to 300M. We know they got a 50M break on it by filming in some country that wants their business. It was heavily marketed, we'll say the net marketing and production is probably around $330M. It's likely to make maybe 220M world wide when the dust settles, getting less than half (but we'll round to half). So $330M cost which garners $110M in theaters, meaning a massive disaster, losing over $200M dollars. They'll get some back w/ dvd/bluray and the Disney+ rights - but this is awful and catastrophic.

Disney doesn't invest 100-300 million dollars over three years to even break even, much less lose it outright.

This has to be the absolute worst year for Disney with movies. We're not even talking about the $170M they threw away with Peter Pan and Wendy, or the $200M fiasco with Secret Invasion or whatever that hated Disney+ show was. This is a train wreck for them, I can't see how anyone can say otherwise.

And this is you being generous af which I know you are aware of. These budgets are literally just what disney is willing to admit to. And budgets are what they plan to spend making the movie....... not what they actually end up spending. There is a real chance Indiana Jones cost around $500 million or more to make. Marvel is also notorious for going wayyyyyyyy over budget

The updated news with Little Mermaid was 293 million cost, 140 million marketing.

The Marvels” cost $273 million to make, but some are saying that number might turn out to be much higher since the data is based on financial reports from the end of September 2022 and does not include post-production work.

Many times we don't know the cost until about six months after the movie came out.

Doctor Strange 2 for example, it was finnaly revealed that it cost 300 million to make. Plus the marketing. Which was probably 140-150 million.

That should be 900 million. This is the loss from the last several movies and projects.

Total losses is several billion.

I'm not sure if the vid was wrong, I typoed, or he misspoke. I looked the number up on the internet and I found 900m, which matches the number.

It sounds like Disney is hemorrhaging money , also didn't they just announce higher theme park prices?


Probably to offset the loss in films

They aren’t committing brand suicide though (((they))) are

I wouldn't place too much stock in Hollywood figures... they're notoriously sketchy.

By way of example, the original MIB famously still hasn't turned a profit, despite Sony pumping out 3 sequels. Guess they really are in it just for the art....

I watched Indiana Jones a while back and it rly wasn't horrible. It was better than Crystal Skull and Temple of Doom IMO. But yea, nearly every movie Disney put out this year has been trash pretty much. GOG and Ant Man were just okay, but not amazing. Their shows have been pretty good lately tho. Andor was fantastic, Mandalorian was good, and Loki season 2 was awesome. Ahsoka was better than I expected as well.

Movies are just a dead medium. You can tell a much better story via a show.

Men In Black

Budget
$90 million[1]
Box office
$589.4 million[1]

Disney is relying on Blackrock to bail them out when they pump out ideological garbage inline with the ESG/DEI metrics

Well let Blackrock bailout them to the tune of 190 Billion

Using a 2.5X multiplier on movies with massive budgets is not correct. The more expensive the move the smaller the multiplier. I think 2X is a decent standard, doesn't change the overall picture for Disney but to act like the LM and Elementals didn't make money is crazy. Particularly given their toys, product tie ins, streaming, etc.

And think of all the high dollar bombs the studios put out each year. They have 3 or 4 bombs for every hit, yet they still spend hundreds of millions on these films. Either these films don't really cost any where near what the studios tell us or their getting revenue from sources that we underestimate. The last MI folk barely made it's budget. There will be another one.

Christ, stupid **** Sillie is still trying to convince himself a movie isn't a flop, that's actually a flop......

Ligtle Mermaid, 290 million dollar budget, 140 million in marketing. Total cost, 430 million dollars. It made 590 million worldwide. JUSA explains how the studios get half, the theaters get half.

Still insists it didn't flop......

Then rambles about toys.......

You also have to factor in movies don't sell DVDs anymore, these properties are not generating toy sales like they used to. In the past a movie could be a moderate success, but would keep generating revenue for years to come through merchandising. Nobody is buying their son The Marvels toys.

I was gonna say, who the **** buys DVD's anymore???

I see the post below yours (Dave) is calling you a stupid **** for you making a civil argument counter to what I said.

Now, I am going to disagree with you and I'm going to do my best to tear your argument to pieces and prove why I am right and you are wrong, but before I do that I will address post#134. Which, I don't have any problems with Dave, we often see eye-to-eye and such, plus what he did is kind of permeated into the culture here... but it's ****ty culture, so while a lot of us engage in this stuff, myself in the past very much included, I will take a moment to say it was unnecessary.

To you: We don't know the tie-ins. Unpopular movies generally don't have as many. Let's not pretend in 2023 kids are desperate to get the latest Indiana Jones and Phoebe-Waller Whatshername action figurines. DVDs and Blurays are dead. Streaming is where it's at -- and, taking one example, we know the Little Mermaid pre-negotiated $170M streaming rights before the movie even flopped onto screens. So, a big success right? Just add that $170M to their profit? OR, is Peter robbing Paul? Disney+ paid the $170M, they lost the right to sell it elsewhere and Disney+ is losing hundreds of million every quarter.

That's not a success.

Meanwhile, massive blockbusters will have massive marketing budgets. The (likely) 300M Little Mermaid probably had $100-150M behind it in marketing. It made what? 570M world wide? Getting maybe 40% of that? So, 230M in their pockets after a few months, 170M out of one of their hands into the other, then a slow trickle of 'toy' and 'dvd' sales over the next months/years?

That's a failure. Even ignoring how Disney+ way overpaid for the streaming rights. You don't invest $300,000,000 over 3 years and then maybe $100,000,000 in the six months before to generate probably less than that over the next few years.

... and as rough as all that looks, reminder: I listed this movie as a "failure" and not a "bomb". I say it failed because, as an investment, it's either underperforming or (probably) actually lost money - so, if I were truly being fair, I should have listed this as a "failure and possible bomb".

I was being generous, as someone pointed out, because I knew as strong as my position was, I could be giving and still hit a home run. That's how ****ed in the ass Disney's 2023 has been, I can yawn and almost passively show how miserable they did.

I wonder, I've listened to actors talk about how much money they lose because of the DVD sales are gone and think that now they have to pay actors more to get the more known ones to compensate.

It doesn't matter what facts you post, he'll still insist otherwise.

Look at all the drama with the Snow White movie, constant reshoots, they keep pushing back the date, once again, a price range around 300 million dollars, not including marketing, an actress who won't shut the **** up.

You may be right but... really, this is one of the most slam-dunk arguments I've ever seen here in the randp. A lot of times, we're all dicking around talking about hypotheticals and feelings, and this-and-that... few times are we discussing things that have actual quantifiable numbers behind them like this.

For once, things are pretty black and white.

Related, and I haven't even fully finished but I love the Critical Drinker, he's going over Disney's disastrous 2023...

Yeah, he had a quick review of Napoleon that was pretty humorous.

I liked the YouTube Historians review of Napoleon even better.

Unfortunately saw the movie and it was beyond terrible, they turned him into a whiny, weak, incel like cuck, throwing constant temper tantrums.

Funny how concerned the left wants Twitter to be over ad losses

Completely ignoring all media that goes left takes a big hit, albeit they are too big to fail but they sacrifice big losses to push their agenda,

yet X has to give up free speech for the megacorps.

How many Wonka movies are they gonna make????

I mean, the movie in the 70s was trippy, scary in a way, used actual midgets, the colors made sense, and reflected the times, and it's something that can't really be captured again.

If making billions of dollars isn't fine then I guess I don't want to be fine. Sure, they aren't making as much as they used to but they aren't burning cash.

I assume that is a joke regarding Hulu. Disney can raise tens of billions in equity capital alone over night. Wall Street would be salivating to raise that money for them.

Sony claims it still hasn't broken even....

https://edition.cnn.com/2023/07/19/b...ike/index.html

I mean, I think we can all agree we can not take their words at this, when Hollywood accounting is the issue (to avoid paying the high taxes they often promote with heavily left-leaning content). If they can use smoke and mirrors to show something 'did not make money' then they pay less, but realistically we can just look at x2.5 budget and make reasonable conclusions.

If you truly believe that movies need to make 2.5x their cost to BE, if you look at the list of movies from the last 10 years, what huge blockbuster movies (say $150M+ budgets) breached this mark. I've looked at this before and it way way less than 50%. Yet each and every year the studies pump out more of these high cost movies. Why is this? It's because studios way way inflate budgets and have additional revenue streams we're not aware of.

I agreed with you that Disney had a terrible 2023. And I agree that breaking even or making a couple of tens of million on a $300M investment isn't a success. But it's not a flop as Dave the Tard keeps arguing. If it was, why wouldn't Disney just cancel Snow White given how "much money the recent movies have lost" and with all the conservative outrage already over it? It's because of just what I said, these studios make way more money on these movies than we're told.

Why would another Mission Impossible be made when the last one lost hundreds of millions according to your math?

Hope? Businessmen don't invest money on hope and keep their money very long.

Here’s the part that makes people (incorrectly) assume they are failing. You are assuming the wrong objective, which is to make money. Yes they want to make money, but what’s more important is the reprogramming of society. People with real money will keep pouring it into stuff like this, so it doesn’t matter how many terrible movies/flops they pump out. It’s similar to the media that promoted TDS. Ratings for CNN, MSNBC, etc. etc. all went down the toilet but they only doubled down on their approach. So clearly the motive wasn’t to report factual news. And clearly the motive wasn’t to make money(or at least that wasn’t the main goal). The goal was programming and demoralizing a huge number of people. The endgame with all this woke bullsh!t. Go woke and go broke isn’t really a thing for now because the huge backers are the ones not only funding it, but demanding it. So as long as you do what they demand you’re safe, as you’ll continue to get their support via financial and other means. Disney could have ten more years like this and be perfectly fine. And as far as I can tell, any type of course correction isn’t really an adjustment based on loss of money. It’s simply taking the foot off the accelerator temporarily while still driving society in the same direction. “Slowing” doesn’t mean “change direction”, it just means “give people a little more time to become indifferent to the current bullsh!t we’re promoting before moving on to the next step”.



Cliffs - financial losses don’t matter because money will continue to pour in so they can accomplish the main objective of accelerating clown world.

you're not comparing high budget and high advertising cost movies.

Comparing a lifetime movie to marvels is going to be completely different.