Yeah

Jesus Christ you call me the pseudo-intellectual yet you post this nonsense? I am well aware of how ketone bodies are produced and how your body runs on them. What you are missing and what will likely never get through to you is how the body uses fuels depending on what you are doing, and how you truly never do entirely shift from all glycogen to all ketones.

Again, please read what I have wrote.c Really read it and consider what is being said.

Energy use depends on activity being completed
The lower the intensity of the activity, the higher % can come from fat
Higher intense the activity, the more has to come from carbs

Studies have been done and even on extremely carb restricted diets the muscles themselves typically still store 50% of their capacity of glycogen. Why? Because certain energy pathways--actually most used for high intense activities like... running, jumping.... weight lifting, going up stairs, etc predominantly use glycogen. So without these, you cant do these activities.

This is why keto diets have been linked to lowered performance in athletes.

But again, you are going to dismiss everything I say because it doesnt fit your very narrow and simple idea of how your fad diet works. Its easier to call me stupid, neg me, etc than actually learn what goes on in your own body.

Edit: And for the record, I have taken many courses at the undergraduate and graduate level in anatomy, physiology, biology, and nutrition. I am curious as to what credentialed programs you have taken besides googling random studies on google scholar?

Alright guys let's just talk about how our faces get leaner on keto. I seem to just be reviving a physiology debate.

Your face gets leaner on keto probably for these reasons:
1) Placebo
2) Fat genetics that take stores from face initially
3) Perhaps slight decrease in fluids in the body due to less glycogen stores

Its pretty easy, the hardest two parts are:

1. the first few days
2. the people around you, making sure they dont offer you food or you go out to eat and eat carbs


Its easy to me because you dont have to count calories and you have a simple set of rules to follow for what to eat and not eat. Eating out is doable but youre basically limited to steak or salads with diet soda.

If youre eating a lot less processed foods on keto your sodium intake goes way down, that will also cut out a lot of water retention and some people store it in the face. A lot of times they will recommend you try to get some salt in on keto because your intake goes down a lot.

Actually, people recommend more sodium on keto because you don’t retain water when you cut your carbs because carboHYDRATES make you store more water. You lose water retention when you cut your carbs independent of your sodium intake. If you’re doing keto you may need extra salt to retain enough fluid to stay hydrated. If there are any special face-thinning powers to keto like OP is claiming in this stupidly drawn out thread, it’s becaue of both the weight loss and reduction in facial water retention. Both of these things would also happen on a standard caloric deficit, but the “initial” water weight loss on a keto or low carb diet is greater.

Location: New Jersey, United States
Age: 26

high school lvl classes don't count. you're just an overglorified personal trainer talking as if you have the capacity to study an actual degree. pls go

keto has actually been linked to increased cardio stamina in all athletes, so clearly, your fairy tale should be ignored.

What do you study? What is your degree in? Lmao, still failure to answer this at all or how you have any credibility beyond mine in this discussion. Somehow NJ is the straw your grasp for regarding debate of physiology?

also complete disregard for any factual information discussed. Probably because you have no conceptual understanding of intracellular processes within muscle tissue and how they relate to activity. You just want to chammer and fuss like a school girl without even trying to talk like an adult.

Come on, address any of the points in the post you quoted.....

already addressed your idiotic points before. you're saying keto as a whole is useless and a "fad" diet. why would i bother wasting more time with you? honestly couldn't care less or even give an ounce of fukk about you trying keto. atm i'm just enjoying ruffling your feathers. it's just funny to me how a self proclaimed health "expert" and PT would instantly shut down a ketogenic diet and deem it useless when the facts have already been laid out.

i just hope anyone reading this thread doesn't take you seriously and tries it out for themselves first before making decisions based off some avyless loser.

inb4 your fake dpt degree

i've done a 7 day fast before with just water and salt while lifting heavy (1-5 rep range). you must be retarded if you think you need carbs (or calories) to work out or get anything done physically as you've stated.

Never said it was useless. Can be useful because 1) refined sugars are not healthy 2) Research is suggesting high fat diets are not bad for you like previously though, specifically when you have a lot of omegy 3s 3) Prevents insulin spikes and likely decreases hunger, more fulling meals that takes longer to digest

But it is a fad diet. People like OP think that somehow keto causes him to have reduced fat storage in the face, people think somehow going on keto causes you to get some insane benefit because BRB only eating fats, so somehow must burn way more adipose tissue.

At the end of the day calories in=calories out. Anything else trying to cheat that system is a fad diet. You can keto all you want but if you are eating above maintenance you will gain weight, below it and you will lose weight.

under keto your body holds less water and less bloat so that's why op noticed a better jawline. for example, because i have leaky gut, i bloat to such a degree when eating foods such as pizza, sweets and sodas, that i instantly lose up to 5 lbs after a day of clean eating. that is the truth of the matter. keto is more for rejuvenation, especially if paired with fasting to increase auto****y. intermittent fasting with keto for 2-4 months a year has the strength to reverse cancer, clean out your old dying cells and waste in the body, clean clogged arteries, heal liver, etc. that is why i personally adhere to a ketogenic diet. fat loss is an extra benefit and very welcome.

so no, i don't agree with you saying keto is a fad diet because that's insinuating that it's a useless diet. keto has gotten immensely popular the last few years due to companies looking to rake in money through supps, but before that? keto was popular in the bodybuilding/misc world 10 years ago when i first came here.

well, i do agree with you that extraneous exercise and lifting requires carbs but you will still gain lots of cardio strength under ketosis. i generally maintained my weight and increased my speed/length doing cardio whereas before i was struggling immensely. that's why some marathon runners are doing keto.

This is what always brings me back. Mentally sharp. It's like a drinker who drinks everyday. He doesn't even realize that he's hungover everyday until he stops drinking.

lol

Right

You don't need a keto diet to get this effect. A decent wholefood diet like paleo will be low in carbs by necessity and you can still get the benefits of fruit. It's silly to believe that all carbs are equal when you can see how some carbs affect the inflammation and bloating of the stomach so much more than others, it isn't a huge stretch to believe some carbs have worse effects on other organs also like the skin. Stick to wholefoods, cut out the processed crap, look how your skin improves.

less bloat when you don't eat carbs, alert the press folks

Damn

Astonished

when does keto get hard? 2 days in so far and loving it

I'm day 4 back on Keto after taking about 6 weeks off to eat garbage food in mass quantities. Although I have slept like crap the last two nights, I am already down about 4 pounds of water weight and look less bloated. Hoping to stay under 50g net carbs every day from now to Christmas, where I will have a single cheat day.

What does it matter if you don’t completely shift to using ketones only? You’re using majority ketones as fuel on a ketogenic diet and still using some glycogen because some parts of your brain and a few other processes still need some glycogen... So what’s your point here? You’re still using mostly ketones on a ketogenic diet...

As for your claim on keto diets being linked to lowered performance in the gym.. again this is a fail on your end. Lets look at the evidence and science on it, shall we?

glycogen depletion during strength training is modest and glycogen resynthesis is generally complete within 24 hours regardless of diet
composition.

The Cori cycle provides the body with an important pathway to maintain adequate muscle glycogen levels without glucose from the diet. The lactate produced by your muscles during anaerobic exercise is carried to the liver via the blood and used for gluconeogenesis. As such, the liver effectively recycles the lactate produced during anaerobic exercise back into glucose. The energy for this process can be derived from fatty acid oxidation (i.e. burning fat). This allows the body to produce energy from glucose without actual glucose consumption.

Ketogenic dieting with only ~22 grams of carbs a day has been found to have no impact on strength performance in international level gymnasts training on average 4.3 hours a day.


https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3411406/


Even CrossFit performance has been found to be unaffected by ketogenic dieting compared to a diet with 2.6 g/kg carbs.

http://commons.lib.jmu.edu/master201019/109/


All of the info I’m providing is from Menno Henselmans Bayesian Bodybuilding PT course on keto diets, and he has a BSc magna cum laud from Utrecht University's international honor's college UCU and an MSc with distinction from the University of Warwick, which is much more credible than the basic courses you’ve taken. So you can disagree with me, but you’re also disagreeing with someone who is much more credible than you. Regardless of qualifications, you should be able to address the topic at hand and be able to disprove the info if you want to establish credibility. We'll let the evidence do the talking though, which I have provided, and you have not, other than “oh hur dur I took some courses on this stuff in college and you haven’t so you don’t know what you’re talking about.”

So tell me now, what makes ketogenic diets so retarded? I think at this point it’s time to admit you’re wrong lol

Ummm, yes.. water loss on keto = water loss in face thus giving it a more defined look. No, on a standard caloric deficit you will not get the same amount of water loss as you would on ketogenic caloric deficitNot once, did I ever say that you lose more fat on a ketogenic diet than a moderate carb diet, or that you’d lose more fat in your face.. I said you’d lose puffiness in your face because of less WATER. Again, your rationale for why keto diets are fads is something you’re pulling out of your ass.

I also never said there was “insane” benefits, I said you have less bloat (better aesthetics), less hunger, and better cognitive function. Which are definitely very useful benefits.. The only real downside is dietary restriction. As I've said before in this thread, Keto is the means, not the end.If you're eating fruit or many of the other carbs that are allowed on paleo like potatoes, you almost certainly wont be in ketosis and your glycogen stores will remain saturated. So no, you most likely not be in ketosis on a paleo diet. Again tho, keto is not the end, it's the means.

These were anaerboic high volume bicyclers brah, so it's no surprise on this one. They indeed would probably be better off with more carbs.

I asked this question to Menno yesterday in a live Q&A video in my pt course and this was his response:

"Keto diets tend to increase testosterone because of the high fat intake. However if carbs go really low and is paired with a very high protein intake, research shows that your testosterone could decrease as a result of that."
That's what's up. You can get away with consuming like an apple and go back into ketosis fairly quickly (in less than a day), but if you eat a ton of fruit or carbs on the cheat day, it will take a while to go back into ketosis because your glycogen stores will be fully saturated again. I'd definitely avoid the cheat meal unless you no longer want to be in ketosisYeah those carbs would mostly be fiber.

Your skim milk pre/post training is actually a great idea. What you're doing is referred to as targeted ketogenic dieting, which is a nutrient timing strategy where most carbs are consumed pre/post workout to be used as a fuel without taking you out of ketosis. You're doing it right

Depends on the person, some people do blow back up after keto, however my personal experience I lost 41lbs on Keto and only regained 2-3lbs in the first two weeks when I came off then haven't regained the fat since.

It's a sick diet but I couldn't help feeling like a retard with the stupid orders I had to do if I went for food with people. 'Can I get the steak sandwich without the bread' just lol

gotta call bullchit that she's 50. She looks like she's in her late 20's at best.

So is there any fastest/faster way to get into ketosis when starting out? (without those ketone supplement powders)

Also, is it a good idea to combine both Keto & IF or does that just unecessarily complicate things/make life twice as miserable?

Exercise might push you into ketosis faster, but it generally takes 3-4 days.

IF is good regardless of your diet. It shouldn't make life miserable at all. I don't do it though because I'm hungry af after I work out in the morning.

Yes.

Post rules:

1) A post is not a novel.

Don't write these scrolls because nobody is going to read them. If you want it to be read, keep it short and sweet.

From what i have seen from Brad Schoffenfield analysis of it. What you say seems to align with him.