I dont have very positive views on Zelinsky but he should have just said “ well keep Ukraine neutral” thats it. Zelinsky and Putin should have had a sit down meeting discussing this matter to avoid this human suffering but instead you have the opposite and its ****ing depressing. Thats what happens you have a comedian running a country.


Yes we can blame putin ofcourse but we were adding fuel to the fire lets not kid ourselves. I mean ..first, Zelinsky not wanting Ukraine to remain neutral and second, US having bio labs AT the border with Russia…i mean wtf???
And third, having such pathetic weak leadership. Putin wasnt going to do this because he knew Trump would respond. This man in office is not a leader but a placeholder for dark unknown forces who are directing this country to war.


If Russia and China did the same thing in Mexico or Canada we would react and rightfully so.


This is such a cluster**** That I dont know how well get out of it. The only solution is that ****ing aliens come and disable the nukes before the missile doors open lol.

The American Russophobe reveals zher final form.

This. Excellent post ded srs.

[QUOTE=Muscle2021 post_id=1658397803]you are right, that's why these 2 clowns putin and Z need to come up with a compromise.[/QUOTE]I hope they don't.

I hope Russia pushes harder and takes even heavier losses. Every day this continues the Ukrainian bargaining power gets stronger and the Russian country as a whole gets weaker.

[b]Compromise:[/b]
Get the **** out of Ukraine and give them all your rubles to rebuild.

[QUOTE=TomWanks post_id=1658398963]The American Russophobe reveals zher final form.

[img]https://i.imgur.com/LEJiod7.png[/ibbmg]



This. Excellent post ded srs.[/QUOTE]Putin justified his invasion on demilitarize and denazify. Can't blame the West, USA or NATO for his potato invasion. All blame rests with Putin and his 6+ month buildup of troops and lies.


[QUOTE][URL=https://www.cbsnews.com/news/russia-ukraine-us-putin-says-no-war-biden-call-zelenskyy-invasion-talk/]https://www.cbsnews.com/news/russia-...invasion-talk/[/URL]

Russia insists it won't start a war as Ukraine seeks to tone down the invasion rhetoric from the U.S.

Moscow insists the troops and weapons are only there for exercises, that they pose no threat to Russia's neighbors, and that it can do what it wants with its military on its own territory.[/QUOTE]

feel sad for this guy, pretty much a victim of propaganda.

an NPC

So do you think stuff like this is all just western propoganda?

https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/com...rs_phone_call/

https://edition.cnn.com/europe/live-...0f3ae8db4feed8


But you believe anything the Russians put out?

if it's not on FourChan it's not legit - Beast92

key article here from AP so quoting in full ...

I don't normally post full articles but this one is important ...


Biden to announce new Russia sanctions while in Brussels
https://apnews.com/article/russia-uk...source=Twitter
President Joe Biden plans to announce new sanctions against Russia on Thursday while in Brussels for meetings with NATO and European allies, according to a top national security aide.

Biden, who will take part in a special meeting of NATO and address the European Council summit, is also expected to underscore efforts to enforce the avalanche of existing sanctions already announced by the U.S. and allies.

“He will join our partners in imposing further sanctions on Russia and tightening the existing sanctions to crack down on evasion and to ensure robust enforcement,” said White House national security adviser Jake Sullivan, who declined to further preview new sanctions the president will announce.

Biden is traveling to Brussels and Poland — which has received more than 2 million Ukrainian refugees who have fled since the Feb. 24 invasion — looking to press for continued unity among Western allies as Russia presses on with its brutal invasion of Ukraine.

In Poland, Biden will meet with Polish President Andrzej Duda, who has requested further U.S. aid and a stepped up military presence on NATO’s eastern flank as the war grinds on. The U.S. has already more than doubled its regular troop presence of more than 4,000 U.S. troops. Currently, there are about 10,000 U.S. troops in Poland.

Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania and Romania have also called for a greater NATO or U.S. military presence in recent weeks.

Sullivan suggested that could be coming soon as Biden plans to have talks “on longer term adjustments to NATO force posture on the eastern flank.”

“We feel that it is the right place for him to go to be able to see troops, to be able to see humanitarian experts and to be able to meet with a frontline and very vulnerable ally,” Sullivan said of Biden’s visit to Poland.

Talks on troop adjustments are already underway.

Last week, at NATO’s Brussels headquarters, U.S. Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin and his counterparts weighed what defenses to set up on the organization’s eastern flank, from Estonia in the north through Latvia, Lithuania and Poland down to Bulgaria and Romania on the Black Sea.

The aim is to deter President Vladimir Putin from ordering an invasion of any of the 30 allies; not just for the duration of this war but for the next 5-10 years. Before launching it, Putin had demanded that NATO stop expanding and withdraw its forces from the east. The opposite is happening.

In just the past two months, the U.S. presence in Europe has jumped from about 80,000 troops to about 100,000, which is nearly as many as were there in 1997 when the United States and its NATO allies began an expansion of the alliance that Putin says threatens Russia and must be reversed. By comparison, in 1991, the year the Soviet Union dissolved, the United States had 305,000 troops in Europe, including 224,000 in Germany alone, according to Pentagon records. The number then dropped steadily, reaching 101,000 in 2005 and about 64,000 as recently as 2020.

Biden and NATO have said repeatedly that while the U.S. and NATO will provide weapons and other defensive support to non-NATO member Ukraine, they are determined to avoid any escalation on behalf of Kyiv that risks a broader war with Russia.

Polish leaders have called for a Western peacekeeping mission to intervene in Ukraine, a step that the U.S. and other allies worry could lead to a broadening of the war.

Sullivan added that Biden will also “announce joint action on enhancing European energy security and reducing Europe’s dependence on Russian gas.”

They have stalled. I’m betting he is debating RIGHT now on wether to drop a tact nuke on Mauripol or not, it’s his only option to get momentum going but I think it’ll backfire extremely bad but lots of innocent people will die as well. I hope I’m wrong and they just make some type of deal and stop this nonsense now.

This your General Mark Hertling

Putin critic Navalny was sentenced to gulag today
then his lawyers were arrested for talking to the media
lots info here; scroll down for numerous

civilians filling and moving sandbags in Odessa
while Odessans play music for them
vid

"There are NATO member states willing to be the guarantors of [Ukraine's] security. They, unfortunately, can't give us 100% membership in the Alliance, but are ready to do everything that the Alliance would have to do if we were a [NATO] member" - President Zelensky
Euromaidan Press Euromaidan Press (@EuromaidanPress) March 22, 2022

Dzhokhar Dudayev, the first president of the Chechen Republic of Ichkeria, about Russia and the war in Ukraine back in 1995
https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/com...sident_of_the/
A really interesting clip from the assassinated former president of Chechnya Dzhokhar Dudayev. He talked about Russia and how they’ll get into a conflict over Crimea and later all of Ukraine. This was recorded in 1995, a year before his death at the hands of the Russians.

You didn’t answer the main points. If this was an accident and you’re curious what they were

1. You can’t say you don’t believe something is real because if it was it would be all over the news, and then call it a nothing burger when it turns out to be true. You’re trying to conflate two separate things, the shady private/public position on Ukraine and Ukraine’s actual chances of joining NATO.

2. The US was obviously playing Ukraine and using them to antagonize Russia

But whatever

@quote You keep clinging to this because as I said like 2 weeks ago, your entire position on this conflict rests on it. Have you actually read Zelensky’s quotes? He certainly did not know that Ukraine had zero chance of ever joining NATO. He’s talking about private conversations. Putin is extremely paranoid and suspicious of the US/NATO and I don’t think you can say with certainty that heknewUkraine had no chance of ever joining NATO.

Zelensky is speaking like someone who has been stabbed in the back and hung out to dry, because that’s exactly what happened.

There is a zero percent chance of any nuclear weapon being used unless there is a substantial ground invasion of NATO countries into Ukraine or Russian controlled territories.

So he is STILL arresting anyone who disagrees with him like the tyrant POS he is and we STILL have people defending this idiot. He needs a bullet to the back of the head srs.

ah yes, exactly what he would want to do. to nuke ukraine and bring the entire force of the US on Russia. Why not a chemical weapon instead? Surely that will help Putin

/s

I looked up the NATO articles and under Article 10, Ukraine could join at any time as long as there is unanimous approval.

https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natolive...exts_17120.htm

There is a process to joining, but Article 10 is clear. They could suspend the process, have a vote and Ukraine could have joined NATO even if they were in a conflict. Ukraine could join today if there was unanimity.I was under the impression that because of Crimea they could not join but Article 10 explicitly says only unanimity is required and depositing its instrument of accession with the USA.

From my 10 minute of research, I believe Article 10 supercedes any administrative requirement.

Watta little kunt

God damit I absolutely hate people who think the way that bish does in her tweet.

Also I’ve stated it many times, Russia was going to invade Ukraine REGARDLESS. Poots doesn’t think the Country should exist, and wanted all the resources and money that come with it. Hence 2014, hence him constantly meddling in their affairs but never wanting to be diplomatic. Zelensky has played this almost perfectly so far. If you are going to fight might as well do it when the entire world is backing you with billions of dollars.

Russian soldiers 'are raping women and shooting civilians hiding in their basements', evacuee from Ukrainian city claims

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...basements.html


.................................


Ummm....wait I thought the UKR were kicking their asses??? What will these people say that might actually get the west involved???

What's next? Russian Army drowns puppies?

Oh ofcourse. He does not care about human life…you think hell care if some Russians are caught near the blast? No

Next week or 2 will be interesting on what he decides to do.

don't know if that audio is authentic, but being an immigrant from the former ussr, this is the kind of stuff you come to expect and hear about regularly on the news due to corruption and incompetence, so i wouldn't be surprised if that phone call was real.

The unanimous vote is "just" the final step, but there's a boatload of prerequisites, like complying with lots of criteria, also receiving and fulfilling a Membership Action Plan.

https://www.nato.int/nato_static_fl2...gement-eng.pdf

https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/o...exts_24733.htm

https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natolive/topics_37356.htm

Bosnia has been invited to its MAP over a decade ago, meanwhile Ukraine wasn't even offered one. Doors are definitely open, but it's quite difficult to join the club.

Those are "requirements" but are not part of the Articles. The text of Article 10 should supercede all of the criteria.

This one’s a little more detailed starting at 3:05

No need to join. Ukraine is winning, right?

It doesn't.

Here are the steps of the whole process:https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natolive/topics_49212.htm

I think you are getting too caught up in the semantics, and disregarding the real life reality of what it takes to be a member- including the politics of it.

Anyone else here think recently this might have had something to do with Biden's rapid withdrawal from Afghanistan last year?

They may have known this situation was coming.

Many of us disapproved of how that was handled but given this context it maybe makes a little more sense.

You realize there is a fukking crater between Russia "winning" and Ukraine "losing"

It's literally why you refuse to give a definitive timeline on when Russia will "win" because you have no idea in reality.

I do not mind being wrong, because I do not know the correct answer but semantics is what is important in explicit express text. If under a dire emergency, world ending aliens etc. Could all 30 members vote any country in at any time?

I'm not really trying to argue, I could be wrong.

Barney posted the process:
https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natolive/topics_49212.htm

And it seems like in an emergency, those Accession steps could be completed in 20 minutes if needed.I know real life, but I think this is worth a discussion in the thread. If anything, we all learn more about the process of joining NATO. For the record, I do believe Ukraine will prevail against Russia.If Biden had done it correctly we would have withdrawn a week or two later and not had the complete failure we had.