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Forum » Any Athiest here have children?
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Thread: Any Athiest here have children?

post 1543132031 02-07-2018, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted By BlackJack619⏩
you should fear God
Why? Is this God of yours a colossal prick?
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post 1543132041 02-07-2018, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted By CaliSuperSport⏩
if you go off basic tenants that Christianity seems to set: God imparts free will to humans, there's a standard of tolerable, admirable, and punishable acts humans can commit, and your fate is tied to your track record. Humans can do as they wish.

The notion of "if human is flawed is god flawed?" or "if he's perfect why does he tell us to love him?" both seem non-sequitur. I know we're talking about spirituality and I"m not particularly religious, but I'm not for committing fallacies against either side either.
You don't think he expected more out of our free will? We are a cruel race. I would hope he wanted more.
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post 1543132351 02-07-2018, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted By halfbreedbrah⏩
You don't think he expected more out of our free will? We are a cruel race. I would hope he wanted more.
If he wanted more than he is being given then his design is flawed.
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post 1543132361 02-07-2018, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted By BlackJack619⏩
you should fear God
Lol.
"Seen in the light of evolution, biology is, perhaps, intellectually the most satisfying and inspiring science. Without that light it becomes a pile of sundry facts -- some of them interesting or curious but making no meaningful picture as a whole."
post 1543132461 02-07-2018, 04:53 PM
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Originally Posted By BlackJack619⏩
you should fear God
Lmao I might as well fear Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy.

No, I fear delusional religions wack-jobs like yourself. And you're high if you think I'm reading any PM from you.
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post 1543132531 02-07-2018, 04:53 PM
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Originally Posted By halfbreedbrah⏩
Not sure what I'm missing. Atheist disbelieve in the existence of God/gods.Agnostic believe nothing is known.
You said he wasn't an atheist because he admitted that he might be wrong... That is not the way this works.

Imagine 3 statements.
1. I got dressed this morning.
2. I took a big crap this morning.
3. I found a million dollars in a suite case on my way to work.

All 3 are possible and "Might be true" that doesn't stop your mind from running it through the BS test.

1. Most people get dressed in the morning - I believe it. (Well maybe I didn't get dressed, possible)
2. Well dropping a deuce is a natural body function. Some people have big chits, but I have never seen your chit - I don't know
3. I recall hearing a news story about this once, but I have NEVER heard of anyone I know finding something like this. - I am calling BS. (Maybe you show a suite case to me with a million in it. Aww chit)

By saying "I might be wrong" doesn't make my disbelief any less real. It just shows that a person is smart enough to reevaluate additional evidence.

I just get bothered by people telling me about what I believe after I just told them what I believe.
post 1543132691 02-07-2018, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted By BlackJack619⏩
I believe what the bible says who God is and the bible says God is every thing and everyone, so lack of believing in God makes me think you lack the belief in your self and to attract your desires of this world
to those that think this is a neg worthy post I have pity on you, but I am praying you see the light
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post 1543132731 02-07-2018, 04:55 PM
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Originally Posted By djfuzzy⏩
Dude, this is one of the main reasons, I think, a lot of people turn from religion. But the god of the Bible doesn’t just ask you to love him, he straight up threatens your existence with eternal damnation if you do not comply with the tenets of believing and loving him. “Not easy to love” is a drastic understatement, and makes the whole concept of Christianity (to me, at least) seem like a severe case of battered wife syndrome. This is my opinion, and I don’t mean to take a dump on the beliefs of others, I was once a believer too - it’s just that the more I thought about it all, the less it made sense to me.
, Idk man god might be cruel. Free will but he da**s us for the decisions we make. He** is cruel something eternal for 100 yrs of bad but does he just have high standards?
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post 1543132811 02-07-2018, 04:55 PM
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Originally Posted By PlanoLifter⏩
Why? Is this God of yours a colossal prick?
he gives and he takes away, blessed be his name
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post 1543132891 02-07-2018, 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted By halfbreedbrah⏩
You don't think he expected more out of our free will? We are a cruel race. I would hope he wanted more.
If he's a god then creation is his plaything, he lets it loose and then imposes his will as he chooses.

I realize that's not a satisfactory answer for most atheists because I've swayed between religion and atheism, but even in Christianity I remember reading that manifestation of his punishment isn't always consistent.

Then again this is probably where debate breaks down because religion starts to feel far too open-ended for most non-believers.
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post 1543133141 02-07-2018, 04:58 PM
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Originally Posted By BlackJack619⏩
he gives and he takes away, blessed be his name
This is no reason to fear a God.
74
post 1543133161 02-07-2018, 04:58 PM
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Originally Posted By acrawlingchaos⏩
James Clerk Maxwell was never known to be insane or crazy. He was always considered a poet and a scholar. What other fallacious comments can you make to support your non point?
I apologized for the misunderstanding. I was talking about Marconi. It could be rumor or speculation /misinterpretation though. My point wasn't about him in particular. It is about things that are true are often not thought to be logical until they are more fully understood. A reference about Marconi:

It may interest you to know that Marconi's "friends" had him taken into custody, and examined in a psychopathic hospital, when he announced he had discovered a principle through which he could send messages through the air, without the aid of wires, or other direct physical means of communication. -Napolean Hill

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technolog...marconi-birth/


It later transpired that the letter he sent explaining his wireless telegraph machine had been dismissed as madness – the head of the ministry apparently scrawled "to the Longara" on the document, referring to an asylum in Rome.
post 1543133361 02-07-2018, 05:02 PM
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Originally Posted By PlanoLifter⏩
This is no reason to fear a God.
im just glad you are questioning
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post 1543133511 02-07-2018, 05:04 PM
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Originally Posted By Rabbitjb⏩
Truth it’s pretty much the lack of existence that does it for me
Just some food for thought from someone much smarter than me:

“People take it for granted that the physical world is both ordered and intelligible. The underlying order in nature-the laws of physics-are simply accepted as given, as brute facts. Nobody asks where they came from; at least they do not do so in polite company. However, even the most atheistic scientist accepts as an act of faith that the universe is not absurd, that there is a rational basis to physical existence manifested as law-like order in nature that is at least partly comprehensible to us. So science can proceed only if the scientist adopts an essentially theological worldview.”

–Physicist Paul Davies, the winner of the 2001 Kelvin Medal issued by the Institute of Physics and the winner of the 2002 Faraday Prize issued by the Royal Society (amongst other awards), as cited in his book God and the New Physics (first quote), and from his acceptance address of the 1995 Templeton Prize (second quote).
post 1543133631 02-07-2018, 05:06 PM
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Originally Posted By halfbreedbrah⏩
, Idk man god might be cruel. Free will but he da**s us for the decisions we make. He** is cruel something eternal for 100 yrs of bad but does he just have high standards?
Da**s? Don’t know what you’re saying with your unnecessary censoring.

High standards? But he created everything? Why did he then create things that aren’t up to his standards? Why did he choose to let us subservient beings circumvent his rules and then get all mad about it?

Also, you can say hell, it’s okay...it’s in the Bible
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post 1543134141 02-07-2018, 05:12 PM
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Originally Posted By djfuzzy⏩
Da**s? Don’t know what you’re saying with your unnecessary censoring.

High standards? But he created everything? Why did he then create things that aren’t up to his standards? Why did he choose to let us subservient beings circumvent his rules and then get all mad about it?

Also, you can say hell, it’s okay...it’s in the Bible
Do you want people you forced to follow and worship your every command or would you prefer people who chose you?
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post 1543134251 02-07-2018, 05:13 PM
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Originally Posted By feminineenergy⏩
Just some food for thought from someone much smarter than me:

“People take it for granted that the physical world is both ordered and intelligible. The underlying order in nature-the laws of physics-are simply accepted as given, as brute facts. Nobody asks where they came from; at least they do not do so in polite company. However, even the most atheistic scientist accepts as an act of faith that the universe is not absurd, that there is a rational basis to physical existence manifested as law-like order in nature that is at least partly comprehensible to us. So science can proceed only if the scientist adopts an essentially theological worldview.”

–Physicist Paul Davies, the winner of the 2001 Kelvin Medal issued by the Institute of Physics and the winner of the 2002 Faraday Prize issued by the Royal Society (amongst other awards), as cited in his book God and the New Physics (first quote), and from his acceptance address of the 1995 Templeton Prize (second quote).
I can find smart atheists quotes too...

Even throwing God into the equation eventually something either "always existed" or came from nothing.

If God always existed I am taking a position as given with out wondering where it came from.
Or
I am taking a position that an infinitely complex being I can't observe evolved on its own.

IMO this is just pushing back the conversation a level and by doing so we have pushed it back to a place where we have no observable evidence. No thanks.
post 1543134421 02-07-2018, 05:15 PM
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Who said God always existed?
As
post 1543134501 02-07-2018, 05:16 PM
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#229
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Originally Posted By CaliSuperSport⏩
If he's a god then creation is his plaything, he lets it loose and then imposes his will as he chooses.

I realize that's not a satisfactory answer for most atheists because I've swayed between religion and atheism, but even in Christianity I remember reading that manifestation of his punishment isn't always consistent.

Then again this is probably where debate breaks down because religion starts to feel far too open-ended for most non-believers.
perhaps he was lonely? I know that sounds stupid but say their is one god then nothing else. What would you do?
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post 1543134571 02-07-2018, 05:17 PM
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I knew I was always going to have children so did they exist before they did in the flesh?
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post 1543134741 02-07-2018, 05:19 PM
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Originally Posted By BlackJack619⏩
Who said God always existed?
The bible.

You said the bible is 100% True thus you also did.
post 1543134941 02-07-2018, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted By halfbreedbrah⏩
Do you want people you forced to follow and worship your every command or would you prefer people who chose you?
Chose. Which is the biggest gripe with Christianity, IMO. You aren’t choosing, per say, you are intimidated into choosing via threat of eternal damnation.
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post 1543135011 02-07-2018, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted By halfbreedbrah⏩
perhaps he was lonely? I know that sounds stupid but say their is one god then nothing else. What would you do?
If I was an omnipotent being I'd follow the same concept: mold the universe as you see fit. And that's the crux of the debate - is our reality the product of complete cosmic chance, or was it a willful creation?
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post 1543135081 02-07-2018, 05:24 PM
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Originally Posted By halfbreedbrah⏩
I think there are probably aliens since the universe is so amazingly large. I have not a ounce of proof. Things in this life are so perfect. Did it just fall in place?
We (a life form in the universe) exist, and we have a decent understanding of what life like ours requires. We already know there are many many other solar systems and other planets out there. Because there are so many, there's a non zero probability some of those planets may have the same conditions, therefore there's a non zero probability alien life may exist.

We have never observed any universe being created from scratch. We have no idea what it takes to create a universe from scratch. In fact we don't even know that the universe was created from scratch to begin with. Therefore we have not even a logical train of thought like we do with aliens that a god that created the universe exists.

Food for thought.
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post 1543135271 02-07-2018, 05:26 PM
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Originally Posted By BlackJack619⏩
I knew I was always going to have children so did they exist before they did in the flesh?
Have you ever been tested for autism?
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post 1543135911 02-07-2018, 05:34 PM
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Originally Posted By CaliSuperSport⏩
If I was an omnipotent being I'd follow the same concept: mold the universe as you see fit. And that's the crux of the debate - is our reality the product of complete cosmic chance, or was it a willful creation?
Push it back once more...

If it was a willful creation was the creator a willful creation or was it created from scratch...

It is why I don't play the religion game. I believe what I have observable evidence for or at the very least can assign a probability of happening based on observations.

There have been tens of thousands of deities that have been worshiped over the centuries all with similar evidence of existing. Yet people have no problem writing those off as simple mythology...

As such I take Harbingers position "There may or may not be a God, but I am just as sure your god is not real as you are sure Valkyries don't carry off viking warriors to the halls of Valhalla."

Kind of sad that religion was suppressed their theology is so much more dynamic than an all knowing all powerful being that doesn't want you to touch yourself.
post 1543136041 02-07-2018, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted By acrawlingchaos⏩
You have every excuse available as to why Christians are morally superior to nontheists, and you certainly aren't afraid to use them. A simple question about atheists having Children and you point to Hitler, Stalin and Mao?

Let me ask you a simple question (though I know what the answer is different to depending on what context is being used). Is the USA a country founded on Christian principles and by and large a Christian nation with by and large Christian leaders?
Saw you negged me and said I ignored you. I didn't. Just didn't see your question.

Christianity is not about morality. It is about Christ.

Human beings are what they are. We are capable of doing good, but what man has done no bad at all? We are incapable of leading a sinless life.

So Jesus came to save us.

The bit about Hitler and Stalin, Mao, etc. was not in response to that question, but rather to another poster who askwd about intrinsic vs extrinsic sources of morality. Hope that clears that up for you.

Politically, what a loaded question!

Supposedly, Quakers founded this nation, to be free to practice their faith outside of the confines of the state religion, the Church of England. Historians debate it and they know more about it than I do.

The Revolutionary war was more about money and nationalism than anything else - no taxation without representation.

I'm not going to get into judging the leaders of this country who profess to be Christians. I am deeply concerned with what the current political climate is doing to this nation as a whole and the hearts of Christians.

http://www.kansas.com/news/local/article194508159.html

"Trump’s derogatory words about immigrants from Africa and Central America have upset and angered American Christians, particularly those who have ties to missions work in those countries."

"“I would hope that those who call themselves evangelical would take a look at what Scripture says … and ask themselves if this is the kind of approach we want to identify evangelicalism with,” Gordon said.

At the same time, Gordon believes the word “evangelical” is changing, becoming more defined by politics than theology."

The theology I believe in says:

Galatians 3:28

There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
post 1543136151 02-07-2018, 05:36 PM
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Originally Posted By BlackJack619⏩
im just glad you are questioning
Yes I'm questioning why we should fear god. You're the one who claims we should. And you're the one being so intellectually dishonest that you won't answer my question. I don't think you actually believe what you wrote.
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post 1543136401 02-07-2018, 05:38 PM
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Originally Posted By djfuzzy⏩
Chose. Which is the biggest gripe with Christianity, IMO. You aren’t choosing, per say, you are intimidated into choosing via threat of eternal damnation.
If you think its all crap what do you have to fear? If you believe I doubt it's out of fear.
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Originally Posted By Austanian⏩
Push it back once more...

If it was a willful creation was the creator a willful creation or was it created from scratch...

It is why I don't play the religion game. I believe what I have observable evidence for or at the very least can assign a probability of happening based on observations.

There have been tens of thousands of deities that have been worshiped over the centuries all with similar evidence of existing. Yet people have no problem writing those off as simple mythology...

As such I take Harbingers position "There may or may not be a God, but I am just as sure your god is not real as you are sure Valkyries don't carry off viking warriors to the halls of Valhalla."

Kind of sad that religion was suppressed their theology is so much more dynamic than an all knowing all powerful being that doesn't want you to touch yourself.
That's the most divisive thing about religion tbh, you have to accept their rule set and the concept of spirituality/omnipotence. Science, through discovery, establishes a rigid system of understanding and causality.

In the context of Christianity, God has always been. His existence is supposed to exceed the bounds we place on the world, such as time and causality, because he created them. And this is where most internet debates seem to break because it's two groups standing on fundamentally different foundations.

I've done the odd philosophical read on creation vs. cosmology and it goes way more in depth than I ever could, and is pretty stimulating actually.
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