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Forum » Practicing medicine now, I see just how immune doctors are from AI/automation (srs)
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Thread: Practicing medicine now, I see just how immune doctors are from AI/automation (srs)

post 1596517691 01-27-2020, 08:22 PM
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Practicing medicine now, I see just how immune doctors are from AI/automation (srs)

I used to think that AI and supercomputers could effectively replace doctors. But now that I'm actually practicing medicine, such an idea is incredibly lolzy at best.
A big part of medicine is art and another big component is personalization. You can program a computer to follow algorithms but the issue is implementation of it and navigating the logistics is a major art. And so many patients don't fit the algorithm.

I also find that a lot of AI proponents think that doctors just treat simple stuff because they themselves are healthy and only go to the doctor for 1-2 minor issues. Truth is, the *real* patients have simultaneous multi-organ disease (in the clinic or in the hospital), have 2 dozen issues and are on 30 medications at once.
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post 1596517821 01-27-2020, 08:24 PM
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doctors can think outside the box, computers cant.
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post 1596517941 01-27-2020, 08:25 PM
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all millennial doctors are just googling chit in front of you nowadays anyway

might as well turn them into kiosks
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post 1596518041 01-27-2020, 08:27 PM
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Maybe but if the internet goes down you guys are fuked
I don’t want a large farva, I want a goddamn liter of cola

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post 1596518151 01-27-2020, 08:28 PM
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Originally Posted By ocelo7⏩
doctors can think outside the box, computers cant.
Cope




Srs. In 10-15 years doctors will be replaced by a roomba.

AI can think in different ways humans never have or could. At a certain point AI will be able to cure all diseases.

Most doctors now just prescribe pills
Pronouns: Bro/Brah

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post 1596518191 01-27-2020, 08:29 PM
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No doctor but isn’t what y’all do an algorithm exactly?
Rash? Yes
Fever? No
Itch? Yes
Puss? Yes
Etc
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post 1596518201 01-27-2020, 08:29 PM
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Automation is nothing to worry about in most of our lifetimes unless your job requires no actual thinking, just repetition and pattern recognition.

We're decades away from being able to replace actual skilled jobs, let alone jobs that require human interaction.
post 1596518781 01-27-2020, 08:41 PM
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Once you're out of med school you'll realize you're owned by big pharma
post 1596518921 01-27-2020, 08:44 PM
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Originally Posted By Better
all millennial doctors are just googling chit in front of you nowadays anyway

might as well turn them into kiosks
Lol that's literally 100% false. We look stuff up to reference dosing etc. Like a kidney failure kidney who needs their gabapentin dosing adjusted; you actually need to do calculations first too.
Originally Posted By GerbilFarmer⏩
Cope




Srs. In 10-15 years doctors will be replaced by a roomba.

AI can think in different ways humans never have or could. At a certain point AI will be able to cure all diseases.

Most doctors now just prescribe pills
There were threads in like 2012 saying AI is gonna replace docs. lmao. You can't appreciate the overwhelming complexity of medicine for real complex patients.
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post 1596519101 01-27-2020, 08:47 PM
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The sooner it happens the better.

If you knew the amount of incompetent doctors and surgeons you would be chitting yourself if you ever got checked into hospital.

The amount of people who die every day due to incompetence and fuc ups is ridiculous.

We need Bladerunner tech asap.
post 1596519171 01-27-2020, 08:48 PM
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Originally Posted By WishIWasJawBrah⏩
Once you're out of med school you'll realize you're owned by big pharma
lolwut, I already graduated and lol @ big pharma nonsense.
Originally Posted By JoshLV⏩
No doctor but isn’t what y’all do an algorithm exactly?
Rash? Yes
Fever? No
Itch? Yes
Puss? Yes
Etc
No. There's far too much grey area. How do you manage a patient who's having an active GI bleed and must be anticoagulated because of their 3 new stents? They also have kidney failure and are a type 1 diabetic. There's no algorithm for someone like that. Those are also everyday patients.

Not everyone is a simple cough and rash son.
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post 1596519231 01-27-2020, 08:49 PM
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Originally Posted By JoshLV⏩
No doctor but isn’t what y’all do an algorithm exactly?
Rash? Yes
Fever? No
Itch? Yes
Puss? Yes
Etc
The problem is that not every patient fits the classic presentation of a disease. Very basic example, just today I saw two people with pneumonia:
Person A) Polysubstance abuser complaining of every symptom known to man. Clear lung sounds. Normal white count.
Person B) Healthy looking guy who came in for leg weakness. Some questioning reveals he has had a chronic dry cough for a few months and night sweats, but that wasn't a concern to him. Clear lungs. Elevated white count.
Same diagnosis yet two very different presentations, neither which really present like the pneumonia you learn in skool.
post 1596519241 01-27-2020, 08:49 PM
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Originally Posted By doughnutking⏩
The sooner it happens the better.

If you knew the amount of incompetent doctors and surgeons you would be chitting yourself if you ever got checked into hospital.

We need Bladerunner tech asap.
You're not in medicine, how in the world do you know who's competent and who isn't? I'm at an academic center and there is like 1 doctor who I wouldn't trust personally out of the hundreds here.
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post 1596519351 01-27-2020, 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted By Hardlifter9⏩
lolwut, I already graduated and lol @ big pharma nonsense.

No. There's far too much grey area. How do you manage a patient who's having an active GI bleed and must be anticoagulated because of their 3 new stents? They also have kidney failure and are a type 1 diabetic. There's no algorithm for someone like that. Those are also everyday patients.

Not everyone is a simple cough and rash son.
Was asking for a friend. He also has yellowy discharge from penor....?
Jesus, kang of kangs, accept me into your heart and kangdom.
Amxn.
post 1596519381 01-27-2020, 08:51 PM
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I haven't been to the doctor in over 30 years. Everyone i know is on some pill for life that they don't really need. People get a flu shot and still get the flu. Muh anxiety, muh depression, muh adhd, muh low back pain, muh fibromyalgia. Family physicians don't actually cure anything, that is why they call it practicing medicine.
post 1596519401 01-27-2020, 08:51 PM
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Originally Posted By Hardlifter9⏩
You're not in medicine, how in the world do you know who's competent and who isn't? I'm at an academic center and there is like 1 doctor who I wouldn't trust personally out of the hundreds here.
A recent Johns Hopkins study claims more than 250,000 people in the U.S. die every year from medical errors. Other reports claim the numbers to be as high as 440,000.

Medical errors are the third-leading cause of death after heart disease and cancer.
post 1596519471 01-27-2020, 08:53 PM
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Originally Posted By Hardlifter9⏩
lolwut, I already graduated and lol @ big pharma nonsense.

No. There's far too much grey area. How do you manage a patient who's having an active GI bleed and must be anticoagulated because of their 3 new stents? They also have kidney failure and are a type 1 diabetic. There's no algorithm for someone like that. Those are also everyday patients.

Not everyone is a simple cough and rash son.
In all realisticality, a computer would be far superior at dealing with data like that. The sheer number of complexities and the potential for human error as the complexity increases, that’s prime AI real estate

But we’re a loooong way from any of that
post 1596519491 01-27-2020, 08:53 PM
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Originally Posted By doughnutking⏩
A recent Johns Hopkins study claims more than 250,000 people in the U.S. die every year from medical errors. Other reports claim the numbers to be as high as 440,000. Medical errors are the third-leading cause of death after heart disease and cancer.
Old news and discussion. Vast majority of those patients were terminally ill to begin with. The probability of dying from a medical error as a healthy person is virtually nonexistent.
Also includes nursing errors aka administration of correct medicines and dosages.
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post 1596519521 01-27-2020, 08:55 PM
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Originally Posted By GerbilFarmer⏩
Cope




Srs. In 10-15 years doctors will be replaced by a roomba.

AI can think in different ways humans never have or could. At a certain point AI will be able to cure all diseases.

Most doctors now just prescribe pills
This except I wouldn't say 10-15 years, probably in a lot longer time

OP don't cope you know very well it's just a trade that can be done by a robot...
post 1596519591 01-27-2020, 08:56 PM
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Originally Posted By Destor⏩
In all realisticality, a computer would be far superior at dealing with data like that. The sheer number of complexities and the potential for human error as the complexity increases, that’s prime AI real estate

But we’re a loooong way from any of that
No, because it's an art. It's grey area. And there is no right answer. Algorithmic approaches only work when it's A or B.
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post 1596519611 01-27-2020, 08:57 PM
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Originally Posted By doughnutking⏩
A recent Johns Hopkins study claims more than 250,000 people in the U.S. die every year from medical errors. Other reports claim the numbers to be as high as 440,000.

Medical errors are the third-leading cause of death after heart disease and cancer.
BOOM. AI is needed at this point. It would cure Cancer, heart diesease, and medical errors.

Doctors now are like community college drop outs
Pronouns: Bro/Brah

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post 1596519681 01-27-2020, 08:58 PM
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You might think it's impossible, but they are working on it OP. In the meantime, they will just lower the demand for physicians by doling out responsibilities/privileges that were once restricted to physicians to mid level practitioners. Instead of a team of physicians on staff, it will mostly be you and a your lot of NPs/PAs. You'll be signing off on prescriptions written by others, for patients you could examine a whole of 7 minutes (to confirm indications), and, of course, the responsibility will ultimately lie with you. If your license gets dinged because a patient was mismanaged/misdiagnosed, you can rest well knowing this: at least your efforts made the chain clinic/hospital's shareholders more money, until the machines take over.
post 1596519791 01-27-2020, 09:00 PM
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Originally Posted By Adam16121⏩
You might think it's impossible, but they are working on it OP. In the meantime, they will just lower the demand for physicians by doling out responsibilities/privileges that were once restricted to physicians to mid level practitioners. Instead of a team of physicians on staff, it will mostly be you and a your lot of NPs/PAs. You'll be signing off on prescriptions written by others, for patients you could examine a whole of 7 minutes (to confirm indications), and, of course, the responsibility will ultimately lie with you. If your license gets dinged because a patient was mismanaged/misdiagnosed, you can rest well knowing this: at least your efforts made the chain clinic/hospital's shareholders more money.
Oh yeah midlevels are the biggest problem for medicine in 2020. It's thankfully not as bad in Canada but you're right. Though the job market for docs is still excellent in even saturated parts of USA.
When family docs are making ~300k or have explosions of job ads, that's saying something.
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post 1596519841 01-27-2020, 09:01 PM
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Originally Posted By Hardlifter9⏩
The probability of dying from a medical error as a healthy person is virtually nonexistent.
You have either been brainwashed or in denial if you actually believe this.

Healthy people go for routine ops every day and don't make it out alive.

Doctors misdiagnose and kill people everyday.... and so on.
post 1596519881 01-27-2020, 09:01 PM
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Surgeon here. I say AI will replace us soon. Radiology is already a dying field.
post 1596519961 01-27-2020, 09:03 PM
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Originally Posted By doughnutking⏩
You have either been brainwashed or in denial if you actually believe this.
I'm giving you facts. Your ambulance trip to the ER is far more dangerous than being harmed by the hospital through a doctor medical error.
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post 1596520001 01-27-2020, 09:03 PM
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Build a robot that is right 75% of the time, has a $5 "office visit", and has a prescription pad and tell me you wouldn't make a killin'
post 1596520021 01-27-2020, 09:03 PM
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Originally Posted By p100⏩
Surgeon here. I say AI will replace us soon. Radiology is already a dying field.
An strong career field to bb.com user title ratio
Jesus, kang of kangs, accept me into your heart and kangdom.
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post 1596520141 01-27-2020, 09:05 PM
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Originally Posted By randomcrash⏩
Build a robot that is right 75% of the time, has a $5 "office visit", and has a prescription pad and tell me you wouldn't make a killin'
Who gets sued for the 25% of the time it isn't right?
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post 1596520251 01-27-2020, 09:06 PM
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Originally Posted By Hardlifter9⏩
Who gets sued for the 25% of the time it isn't right?
We'd have to program it to hide it's mistakes like what the human doctors do.

At least we could learn from the machines mistakes unlike the human doctors who hide them so we cannot learn how to improve the system.

The system as it stands today is completely flawed.

I welcome the machines.
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