True, that’s good. I’ve tried a few meds in the past & they did nothing for me. The only time I feel normal is at night for the most part.

I've been a lot more social lately. Basically starting conversations a lot with people and basically talking most of the day at work but still nothing is happening. I just feel stuck in life. Like i am going to do this exact routine until the day i retire. You can't just go out to bars or the gym or somewhere and meet people these days. Especially if you are an introverted male. I just wish i had a community at work at least. Anything besides crippling loneliness.

Any brahs with legitimate chemical depression, Nardil has completely changed my life (and this is after being on 20 different antidepressants over the years as well as ECT, rTMS, ********). Feel like a totally different person.

Want to aware you on the best antidepressant out there (also amazing for social anxiety):

- It's not going to help you if you're depressed because of situational circumstances like sloots, work, etc (unless those situations arise because of social anxiety)
- There are currently production problems with it so who knows whether it will continue to be available.

I like the way you capture it in words so well. That is what I always tried to describe to the psychs back in college. A social anxiety that isn't cognitively driven, that isn't fear based and anticipatory, but is rather like a physical illness. And all of the negative situational circumstances that cause depression stemming from that.

i heard this was a miracle drug but the diet restrictions are crazy right? Like no Cheddar cheese or something? How can you even do that. Like you are at a social function and have to tell everyone you cant ea 90% of the food because of an antidepressant? Isn't that awkward??

Thanks so much. I can fully see how social anxiety could lead to true depression.This is the thing. It's absolutely a lie. I haven't changed up my diet one iota since starting Nardil. I eat cheddar cheese every day. Doctors are wildly miseducated about this. Tyramine has to be very high in foods for this to be even problematic. If you avoid red wine and aged cheeses you should be fine. This whole dietary thing is largely a myth that has led to the woeful underprescribing of MAOIs (mainly Nardil and Parnate).

Of course you should research this yourself and it's prudent to be mindful about potentially dangerous interactions but please see link below:

https://psychotropical.com/

For me this HAS been a miracle drug. Has 100% eliminated depression and any social anxiety that I did have (although my reason for taking it has been severe depression). It's somewhat GABAergic I believe and may well work for people that don't respond to serotonergic type drugs (like SSRIs).

I generally hate zealotry about 'miracle' cures and can't guarantee that this would work for any of you guys but it has changed my life. Maybe it will stop working and maybe I won't be able to get any more when I run out, I don't know. But for now this is light night and day for me and just wanted to aware you.

Unfortunately because of misinformation about this drug it's not so easy to get prescribed. IMO it's a crying shame because it knocks SSRIs, Wellbutrin, Venlafaxine, Mirtazapine, etc out of the park. But if you do respond to one of those type drugs then stay on that because it's much easier than having to deal with Docs who don't prescribe MAOIs, are worried about side effects, etc and the current shortage.

It's just if none of those work for you, please give this a try if you can get it. It was my last Hail Mary, really and I'll stick around on this planet as long as I can get it and it keeps working.

I'm going to try Cabergoline first because I have some coming in the mail. If that doesn't work after a few months, I will try to get Nardil.

I tried all the other antidepressants you listed btw and they didn't do chit.

Carbegoline is one I hadn't heard of. I looked it up though and is it more of a hormonal thing than an antidepressant? I hope it works for you though man. If not try to get Nardil or Parnate.

None of the meds I listed did anything for me and those were just a few I have been on. Could have added a fair few others.

Did you wake up and feel like a different person? You really cant drink soda? How are your muscles? Did your mood go from not feeling emotion when you laugh to now finally feel it? Also, I'm happy you've found something that works!

Hi and thanks so much! I drink soda every day (probably not good for me but nothing to do with Nardil). Where did you read that soda was a problem?

I started on 45mg and quite quickly increased to my current dosage of 75mg/day (fairly high but not the highest - maybe a lower dose would have been fine and I may go down to 60mg).

I had about a week where I thought it was working but couldn't be sure and I had some good days and some bad days in that week. Now every day is consistently good.

Yes, absolutely the genuine emotion is back there. When I would laugh before it was typically fake, for other people's benefit. I don't feel numbed in the slightest by it. I just feel like I did before ever suffering depression.

The only side effect I have had is bad orthostatic hypotension (BP drop when going from lying to standing). I have stood up too quickly and fainted a couple of times, actually injuring myself. I know this sounds, and is, serious but I think it goes away after a bit and it's just something you need to be careful with.

In terms of muscles, do you mean in terms of losing gains or just in terms of tiredness? I didn't have any gains to begin with, lol, I have been a runner and not a lifter. But I did go through a little while of feeling more fatigue in muscles than I was used to but that has now passed.

Don't get me wrong either. Nardil can definitely have bad side effects for some people (but then so can SSRIs). It's a powerful drug, to be taken seriously, but for the time being it has literally saved my life.

It may well stop working for me, I don't know. Then there are many people on forums that it hasn't stopped working for in 20 years so I hope I'm one of the lucky ones.

The global manufacturing shortage is the other thing. Nardil may be a hard drug to get prescribed and for your pharmacist to source, at least for now. Many people actually prefer Parnate (more dopaminergic than GABAergic I think) and for now at least the supply problems aren't as bad as for Nardil.

I wouldn't let your Doctor fob you off with Moclobemide. It's a reversible MAOI but it did nothing for me and the consensus is that compared to the 'real' MAOIs it's very weak.

The loneliness is so strong. All I want is someone to hang out with and play pc with or play sports with or something. Its just impossible to find. You cant make friends after mid 20s

i dont get how you even meet women. Online dating doesn't work for me.

Mate, I don't get you. You're with someone long-term aren't you? Don't you like her? If not then why stay?

I appreciate we need male company too but that's supposed to be a kind of add-on. You're right that after a certain age it's rare to hang out with even close guy friends more than a few times a year and it's a shame.

If you're just looking for somebody to play sports with I'm sure you can find that. Making true friends is very difficult past mid 20s, I agree. But even most of the 'true' friends I made during school and uni, I talk to occasionally now and hardly ever see. It is sad, I admit.

I don't think I read soda being a problem. I read a list of dietary restrictions and I think my memory was incorrect about soda lol.

The last time I went into remission from depression I became much more smarter. I think it was after finally losing all those mental symptoms. Did you experience the same?

[Sorry forum forcing me to split this post into 3].

100%. I feel like I have just been scraping by at work and constantly engulfed by this mental fog. Now I have a lot of clarity and am coming up with ideas, solutions, etc. Just performing on a different level.

Depression absolutely does cause cognitive impairment. I'm not sure if they have actually done IQ tests on people when depressed and when in remission from depression but it would stun me if the difference wasn't significant.

I really hope you find something that helps you. I think after being depressed for so long it just kind of becomes the norm. Read my posts from a few pages back before the Nardil kicked in. I had been living with this for so long and had become so exhausted by the living hell that it was that I really was starting to make concrete plans to check out. Haven't thought of suicide once since this kicked in.

That said by no means do I think that I'm now cured and have nothing but good times ahead of me. Once upon a time (a long, long time ago) Seroxat (Fluoxetine - SSRI) worked for me and then it just stopped working. Tachyphylaxis is a thing. Or maybe Nardil will dry up. I'm more taking the attitude of I was done and finished and now I have some bonus days/weeks/months/years. That said there are many people for whom Nardil/Parnate has worked for many, many years.

And now many of them are facing the threat of having to stop suddenly because of shortages. I don't want to make this thread political but it pisses me off to a degree I can't describe when BLM and #metoo receive so much MSM attention. But who cares if thousands of people on the only med that works for them slip back into misery or end up dying because MAOIs are no longer profitable for BigPharma right?

The Mental Health virtue signalling is even worse. Mental Health Awareness, Tweets about reaching out for help, Hotlines, etc. But nobody cares that Pharma companies making billions can pretty much instantly withdraw a life saving drug without any outcry or government intervention.

Bro its just total loneliness. I don't have the same interests as my gf and no sex. At work i don't connect with anyone and basically work alone in my warehouse area. I can't go anywhere and enjoy myself because i don't know anyone. I'm not 100% FA more like 75% but the loneliness is real. I just cope with lifting, working hard and browsing the web man.

Being a quiet male is just automatic loneliness. Even the most trashy people i know have great social lives because they are social and just like to talk to everyone.

I understand, it make sense and in no way did I mean to get at you. I do feel some of the same things as you describe but as I've got older I think I've become more accepting of it. Still mirin' for putting in the effort with lifting and work.

I wish I knew the answer to making friends things, post mid twenties. I do make work buddies but I realise that they're just that, colleagues that I happen to get along with and invariably if I move jobs then I lose touch gradually with them. I think it's better to regard other people as just people to pass time with rather than to form meaningful connections with. I agree with you that it is sad but I would just say that I think that many, many people feel the way you do.

I would suggest meetup groups and stuff like that but I know that they're largely complete bullchit.

I have some self esteem problem where i feel self conscious or ugly around certain people. I don't know how to change it. I just have such low self esteem these days.

Where are you from? I read the usa food and drug administration drug shortage list and nardil isn't on there. Am I seeing something wrong? I hope I'm not because I plan to give this drug a shot one day.

i'd like to go to dr and try an anti , but the sexual sides are not something i wana deal with

i'm fine when i'm working, but this lockdown since march is really working me

i'm fkn exhausted , if i workout or cycle hard, my cortisol get even higher and makes it worse

benzo work, but you can't be on them forever

plus i don;t wana deal with withdraw

living alone and no gf is not helping

even buddy from work said , if i was alone thru this i'd be out of my mind , i have my wife and kids to keep me company

feels

just found love letter from ex in book, now depressed af

I'm from the UK. However as far as I know the Nardil shortage is a global issue (I post on an MAOI forum where several US users are having problems but then others aren't). I think the USA is certainly less affected right now than the UK and, certainly Australia where it is next to impossible to get.

I know this isn't official (rather its a petition) but does reference Nardil shortages in the USA. That said perhaps this is still much easier to get in the USA. I really hope so. I do know that one Australian man flew all the way to the USA to get a year's supply of Nardil so maybe there still is plenty in the USA for now.

https://www.change.org/p/end-the-sho...tion_dashboard

Even in the UK I have been able to get Nardil without problems recently but I expect that to change soon.

Ironically I have friends who have been working from home for months now and their wife and kids are driving them utterly insane! Will be interested to see stats on domestic violence during lockdown if/when they become available. Can't imagine being locked up in an apartment all day with 2 or 3 young children. But yeah of course then being on your own is lonely af too.

Is there an accurate list online of foods to avoid while taking nardil? Getting really into this. I might search for a way to try this drug if my current antidepressant doesnt work.

I haven't changed my diet at all but you're absolutely right to be cautious. I don't know how official this is but it's a list I found. I have been eating yoghurt and cheese every day. I have also drunk wine (white) many times. But of course it is sensible to avoid these.

Phenelzine Interactions

While you are taking phenelzine you must not eat foods that are high in tyramine, including:

aged or smoked meats, fermented meats, dry sausage (including salami, pepperoni, Lebanon bologna), liver, pickled herring;
any spoiled or improperly stored meats, fish, or dairy products;
beer and wine (including non-alcoholic beer or wine);
cheese (other than cottage cheese or cream cheese);
sauerkraut;
over-the-counter supplements or cough and cold medicines that contain dextromethorphan or tyramine;
large amounts of chocolate or caffeine;
yogurt;
fava beans;
meat extracts; or
yeast extracts (including Brewer's yeast).

The dietary restrictions have been overstated. See this website (this guy is an expert in MAOIs)https://psychotropical.com/maoi-diet-info-overview/

Fewer foods than previously supposed have problematically high tyramine levels because international food hygiene regulations have improved both production and handling. Cheese is the only food that has, in the past, been associated with documented fatalities from hypertension, and now almost all ‘supermarket’ cheeses are perfectly safe in healthy-sized portions. The variability of sensitivity to tyramine between individuals, and the sometimes unpredictable amount of tyramine content in foods, means a little knowledge and care are still advised.

Most of the previously held concerns about MAOIs turn out to be mythical: they are either incorrect, or over-rated in importance, or stem from apprehensions born out of insufficient knowledge.

Some Common Myths

The diet is difficult

People cannot have cheese or red wine

MAOIs have many dangerous interactions with other drugs

One cannot give an anaesthetic

It is difficult to swap to and from other drugs

One cannot combine them with tricyclic anti-depressants (TCAs)

They have a lot of side effects

MAOIs cause hypertension/should not be given to hypertensive patients

Tyramine reactions need urgent treatment

Patients should be given nifedipine sub-lingually

Adrenaline cannot be used

I really hope that you get to try Nardil and it works for you. Like I said I have been through every antidepressant out there and 20 rounds of ECT. Didn't touch my depression. Nardil has obliterated it. The side effects I have experienced are:

- Orthostatic hypotension. I fainted a couple of times and actually injured myself. This could have been avoided had I been more careful. This side effect has now passed but it is quite freaky.

- Insomnia. I already suffer from this and Nardil has made it worse. However I feel as rested on 4 hours sleep on Nardil as I did on 8 hours sleep previously. There is always the option to add a stimulant like Dexamphetamine but not suggesting you do this unless fatigue is an issue.

You should also consider Parnate. Many people actually prefer it to Nardil. It is more stimulating whereas Nardil acts on GABA so can be a little sedative but it's great for social anxiety. I do get some social anxiety (or I did) but Nardil eliminates that completely, although it's not the reason I'm taking it.

Please let me know how you get on. I'm really happy to answer any questions. I know we're not supposed to talk about Reddit on here but the Reddit MAOI sub is a helpful and friendly place.

MAOIs really are the nuclear option when it comes to antidepressants. SSRIs are so weak by comparison (but for some people of course they will work fine).

I'm wondering if Parnate can still be sourced from India. I think Nardil is pretty much out of the question from what I've seen so far