Factually incorrect. The dystopia is expanding, not receding, so the 'convergence' you mention will be within subsets of humanity as a whole, meaning - again - that your understanding of 'humanity' begins from a non-starter.The generations are cool, yeah. My wife is giving birth any day now, to our first, so it'll be interesting to see how this plays out in the longer term. It is 'our family' in this case.

Make sure you name your son after me.

Sure that stuff is important, but looks/money/status is also important.

We had a birthday party for our 2 year old on saturday.

She likes going to the playground, as she is a big fan of the swings, but I have been finding bits of glass at the playground (I think teenagers have been drinking beer there in the evenings) and not been happy about it. Consequently, we decided to build her a playground for her birthday.

Both of our families were there and lots of our nieces and nephews have small children, so they were all running around like their hair was on fire. It turns out that if you mix swings, slides, jungle gym etc with cake, kids lose their minds.

lold you know you cannot justify that at all

That a God could exist and create humanity with fundamental flaws, in a world with immense suffering, so that we could (despite the suffering) primarily praise God, is a circular flaw. I'm not denying that a higher power exists (see previous posts), I am saying I have a hard time believing in this God. But, even so, this God you mention would see that even without my believing in it, I still treat people around me very well. The 'do unto others' thing.You're commenting on your own post - how ironic.

don't think you're the first to say "but God should be like this" or "but i'm a good person and God should know that"

Consider how much humanity has converged already. Most of humanity has access to sanitation, and a large chunk now has smart phones and the internet. Your view of the world is stuck in the last century. You are ignoring the consequences of technology and that science represents actual tangible progress toward understanding reality and is not a matter of opinion. There will be cultural convergence as more people can talk to each other.

The cacophony you see today is the growing pains of this process.

Don't think you're the first to react that way.Development cooperation / capacity building are not 'convergence' as such. Socio-economic convergence is what is required for your take, yet - the world is turning an entirely different way. You speak like an idealist here, yet I thought you were a realist. Or are you just playing Devil's Advocate to argue?

The dystopia I refer to in short here is very clear - from CoL, property ownership, education, the breakdown of the nuclear family, the loss of value systems (with our without a belief in God), etc. Maybe you believe in convergence as a 'race to the bottom'? But that's not 'convergence' to me.

It’s important. But there’s something else there. Lately I’ve been thinking about that Johnny Cash cover song (written by Nine Inch Nails) that he sang 6 months before his death. At one point he saysComing from a man who had everything. Pictures of his dead family members around him, and evidence of his wealth in front of him. Written by a man who had a heroine addiction in the 90s (Trent Reznor), who was gifted himself. I’m not drawing conclusions from any of this, just putting it out there.

It has to lead to it long term. Think of the origins of culture itself. Look at the internet and how it has produced its own subculture. You're a gamer so you understand this. More people from more cultures are talking to each other than ever before in human history. And the more cooperation and dialogue exists, the more cultures will converge, even within authoritarian states with the harshest repressions. The cat is out of the bag and can never be put back. Look at the George Floyd protests, for example, that arose all over the world, bizarrely. I am an idealist. I believe in liberal institutions deeply. I think we need to be mindful of what may cause them to fail. That's all.

LOL that is just fascist depression talking. Oh no everything is failing and going to hell in a handbasket and we must return to traditional values to save ourselves right? Come on. As I said, this cacophony is the growing pains of the convergence process. Consider how much input other nations now have on our democratic process and how involved people are online as another example. We effectively made the world much smaller. The moats and language barriers no longer matter. People are no longer confined to their nation. Humanity is fundamentally changing, and traditionalists are terrified and doubling down to resist it, but it is inevitable.

I get it, and I think it is summarized in a different way in the ending of Gangs of New York:



Grandiose thoughts of legacy, or relationships with divine entities - all of that, noise and ego. NYC is a great place to wash that away, for all but a tiny fraction of the people who live here. To dogoodto yourself, and others, needs to come from within. Especially in a world where faith in divine beings isn't what it used to be.

You may call it a grandiose thought of legacy, but people will remember Euclid long after everything else from that period is forgotten. Mathematics and science are perhaps our only true legacies. Everything else gets redrawn and changed. Religions and nations fade away. The math will not because it is true. And the science is approximately true and will keep being iterated upon but never completely discarded.

Gamer? Fascist depression? You're conflating so many issues together - even 'confined to their nation' - have you not seen the pushback from leaders, e.g., in the EU, against the assumed 'cosmopolitanism'? You're picking elements to try to show convergence but you're ignoring socio-economic realities. The richest in this world will become the Wallaces of the future, and the vast majority of the workforce on this planet will have to shift with ai/autonomation coming faster than people realize. All this does is enforce the dystopia, not the divergence.You don't own mathematics, nor are the legacies of 'logic' or 'mathematics' or 'natural sciences' owned by a few, considering the iterations (and vast improvements in the latter category) mentioned. The point of the post you quote there is to show, as Fukuyama did, that there aren't many Riemanns, Christoffels, Curbastros etc. in the future. That was his point with the End of History.

And even if you disagree with that, the point of this thread is to find personal meaning and fulfillment - what is important for the self. The longevity of mathematics is no substitute for being a good father to a child, just saying.

Yes I call it fascist depression. It is the standard narrative seen in the right and in fascists, and it is essential for the justification of intervention and changing the status quo. I told you that pushback is just growing pains. It will fade away as it inevitably must. Socioeconomic realities will change. That's correct about the impact of automation. The way we have organized society will change. That's not a dystopia. I guess it is if you despise every form of socialism...Too bad lol.

They aren't owned, but people will continue to remember the legacy of those who pioneered the work, and their contributions will live on in ways nothing else does.

Fukuyama is wrong. There are more of them. There are more equivalent geniuses today than ever before in human history. The field is just more specialized. I disagree as your bloodline may disappear and provides only so much utility to humanity, while the math lasts much longer. Nobody cares what a chitty dad Gauss was.

Be more clear with 'your' or 'one'. E.g., if you say 'you despise every form of socialism' - you're of course wrong when it comes to me, right? If you mean 'if one does' that, well - that'll change over time in the USA as it gets worse for a lot more people. The dystopia is the growing gap between being decently able to obtain financial security on a modern salary, and inherited wealth / advantage of the few. It is those few that govern the potential for 'convergence' in reality.

A contribution's living on != its continuing to have value. The vast majority of people who study mathematics do it in an instrumental way, and end up going into actuarial work and the like. It's a shame that they don't have more respect for the key figures - but that harks back to my previous point - that trying to equate the longevity of mathematics with loving family relationships is a non-starter.

Not sure why you listed wealth as a pre-condition here.

I meant you generally, not as in you. Yea those few will be taxed up the ahole.

No they don't dude. Mathematicians do math, not actuarial work. Jesus Christ lmao. You do not know what research mathematics is or how beautiful, rich, and creative the field is. Mathematics is quite literally the final and highest stage of human thought. If everyone were substantially more intelligent, people would study the sciences and also continue learning mathematics over the course of their lives while working.

Math is not bean counting. This is a misconception by people outside of the field.

Because I believe that things like 'fighting with your significant other about money' or 'worrying about paying rent on time' significantly undermine quality of life. I listed "required wealth" as the precondition which is, to be fair, rather low. So I could have worded that better.

Be careful as family can backstab you for your wealth.

Sometimes real friends are better.

You'll find something else to fight about.

I wasn't referring to mathematicians. You're the one that brought up mathematics in this thread - you seem to do it often, as if you're looking to convince other people or bait some sort of reaction.

In general, intellectual pursuits (I mentioned this earlier) are as close to the divine as human beings can come. I think you'd be shocked by mine, since you continually write things like 'you do not X, you do not Y' - but it is ratheryouwho does not know. You're just talking past me at this stage, as you have been on the intellectual pursuit side it seems as well.Financial security is a common one, since women do desire 'security' as part of their biological imperative. Not every couple is the same - you should understand that by now.

No. I wasn't talking about you specifically except in the instance where you said most mathematicians become actuaries lmfao.

Anyway, I want to propose a couple of things.

1) Cultural identity is entirely a consequence of geographical limitations and boundaries.

2) Geography is becoming less relevant due to technological progress.

Do you agree with these?

Those two imply everything I said eventually.

Also, technological unemployment doesn't need to lead to a dystopia. You don't have servants washing your dishes anymore because we have dishwashers. That didn't ruin civilization. It made it better. AI will make things better, provided we organize society appropriately and navigate the potential dangers. People will simply be free to do other types of labor or engage in creative, intellectual, or leisurely pursuits rather than wagecel all day.

Like this?

Ever seen this:



Tbh, nobody knows how much I earn except me and my employer. We have enough that my wife has never looked at our accounts or my investments, and I have never told my family. Once, a few years back, my Aunt asked me how much I earn at a Christmas lunch and I blew her off saying it is none of her business. She did the "well if you're doing well you don't need to be in my inheritance" (she's a rich spinster) and I just said "do whatever you want".

I don't like discussing money at all IRL, though I bring it up often here heh.To be clear, I said: "...who study mathematics..." not "mathematicians", because all the folks who take math classes (physics is a good example) or economics (econometrics) are most certainly NOT mathematicians. Read more carefully before laughing - you should've been taught that humility in grad school

On the rest:

1. Disagree, because of interconnectivity - it dissolves those limitations/boundaries;
2. Geography remains relevant due to nation state boundaries, and convergence is limited through the imposition of the state on its people, e.g., DPRK.

Convergence even in the West (say, Western Europe + Canada + USA) is also fluctuating wildly as we see now.

Those people don't really study mathematics in any meaningful way. Maybe theoretical physicists do, but most do not. Economists may be competent in game theory and a few aspects of analysis, but not much else. I am laughing. It's ridiculous what you said, but it is okay because I do not expect outsiders to understand the field at all. You'd be amazed at how enormous the field of mathematics actually is.

1) Historically, it wasn't as connected. Ever since it became more connected, we saw more culture clashes and wars but also much more rapid changes to culture. As the world has globalized, cultures have changed in tandem. Without the historical boundaries, there is nothing there to really retain cultural identity. It will blend.

2) DPRK is in close contact with China and Russia. It will eventually change and converge even with repression. One might not appreciate the changes DPRK has made. But it is slowly liberalizing too. They revamped their economic system in the last decade and have worked closely with Chinese economists to promote growth. And all geopolitical tensions aside, they have signaled an interest in improving relations with the West, as we saw under Trump.

You keep saying that something I said is ridiculous, but instead of reading my posts you ignore their content, e.g., (for the third time) "studying math != mathematicians", because you think I don't get the distinction, but you're the one that conflated the two in your incessant need to try (and fail) to one-up me. This is clear to anyone who reads this (and other) threads. Are you okay? Seriously.

On the rest: you aren't showing convergence. And that you think the DPRK is an example of convergence shows that it is you who does not understand (at all) international relations, which adds a strange irony to your continual conflations/errors/assumptions in your writing. Odd.

I don't consider nonmathematicians to "study math" in any meaningful way. Not sure if that was clear to you.

I know you have a penchant for narcissism and are somewhat on the spectrum (I can tell from your video). But no one is trying to one up you. If it comes across that way, it's automatic because I do actually mog you lmao.

Compare DPRK of 50 years ago to today. You can't possibly tell me it is further away now than it was then. They literally have private companies now. There are no errors except the ones in your poli sci addled brain broheim. But since you are taking this personally and getting upset, we can leave the conversation here.

Oh and as far as the West goes, it's just growing pains as I said before. A bunch of angry whiny fascist bitches are crying because of the culture shock. But the shock is inevitable. Nothing they can do can walk it back or contain it. That's what I mean by fascist depression btw. You can take one look at this board to see it.

Yes exactly.

They do study elements of mathematics through course work. If that's not 'meaningful' to you, that's your subjective take. But they do take courses, and even folks who complete undergraduate degrees in mathematics end up in many applied mathematics fields. Why is this not clear to you?

You're projecting again. You mention 'narcissism' but you come across as that fresh engineering undergrad who clangs his ring against a railing going 'lol what did YOU study brah!'. You say 'no one' but you can only speak for yourself, and your logical failure here shows your ego plain as day. Hence why you follow me around from thread to thread, desperate for my attention. Because it is I who mogs you.

What 'video' are you referring to? You went on some tirade the other day saying you can doxx me - there's no history of me anywhere on the internet, even if you had my real name. You can't find me. So whoever it is you think I am, you're wrong. You don't know my career, nor my educational background, but to be frank - it is I who dominate you in every sense of the word. Hence your need to continually try to measure yourself against me - seeking the approval your father has yet to give you.

Hope you feel better.