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Forum » Has Tom Brady reached Michael Jordan's level of GOATness? (if not, why?)
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Thread: Has Tom Brady reached Michael Jordan's level of GOATness? (if not, why?)

post 1629660123 01-25-2021, 01:14 PM
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Originally Posted By nothingshocking⏩
"older Moss" caught 23 touchdowns that year
He wasn’t even older. He was 30.
post 1629660373 01-25-2021, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted By nosirrahx⏩
Take 1 guy out of any sport for 2 decades and the entire history is rewritten.

How many people are on that list?
Bulls wouldnt have a single ring, yet Belichik's Patriots would have a few IMO.
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post 1629660613 01-25-2021, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted By SmashinYoungVag⏩
He wasn’t even older. He was 30.
30 is old by wide receiver standards. Calvin Johnson was retired by that age
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post 1629660983 01-25-2021, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted By TBO1313⏩
30 is old by wide receiver standards.
In what world? TO Rice Harrison Carter etc have all had monster seasons after 30. 1300+ yard 15 TD+ seasons

Megatron retired for health reasoms
post 1629661213 01-25-2021, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted By SmashinYoungVag⏩
In what world? TO Rice Harrison Carter etc have all had monster seasons after 30. 1300+ yard 15 TD+ seasons

Megatron retired for health reasoms
He said WR standards, not HOF standards. And Megatron is an example of how WRs don't age well.
post 1629661773 01-25-2021, 01:26 PM
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Originally Posted By SmashinYoungVag⏩
In what world? TO Rice Harrison Carter etc have all had monster seasons after 30. 1300+ yard 15 TD+ seasons

Megatron retired for health reasoms
Your talking about 3 of the best receivers of all time in Rice Harrison and Carter. Moss falls in this group as well but those are not normal career trajectories. Jerry Rice was a good receiver after 40 lol. I'm not sure if another receiver has even caught a TD pass after that age
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post 1629661813 01-25-2021, 01:26 PM
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Originally Posted By DynamicDot⏩
He said WR standards, not HOF standards. And Megatron is an example of how WRs don't age well.
WR's can age well if they condition themselves. Chris Carter, Jerry Rice, Tim Brown, etc. etc. aged like wine. Calvin Johnson was just all talent and no heart.
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post 1629661823 01-25-2021, 01:26 PM
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Originally Posted By Ken-O⏩
Bulls wouldnt have a single ring, yet Belichik's Patriots would have a few IMO.
Reread what I said, the entire sport. 2 decades of playoffs change with the removal of 1 guy.

Remove Jordan and you change 1 decade.
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post 1629661933 01-25-2021, 01:27 PM
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nah Mj also had 5 mvps, leading scorer, DPOY , etc.

TB is clutch, long career *(longevity), had an amazing coach most of his career and took paycuts to get better talent. he has been bailed out by his defense numerous times like the last game. GOAT of NFL but nowhere near MJ goatness
post 1629662083 01-25-2021, 01:28 PM
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Nope, most overrated athlete in all of sports. Doesn't even deserve to be in the hall of fame and I hope the nominating commitee sees him for the choke artist, overrated player that he is. In 10 years when Mahomes has 10+ rings all back to back with a true dynasty everyone will see what a great QB looks like.
post 1629662243 01-25-2021, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted By nosirrahx⏩
Reread what I said, the entire sport. 2 decades of playoffs change with the removal of 1 guy.

Remove Jordan and you change 1 decade.
Its still the same answer, the bulls would get more affected than the Patriots. Bulls would have 0 rings yet the patriots would still have been dominant and have a few rings IMO.

So you overall change more with the removal of Jordan than you do with the removal of Brady. Bulls lose 100% of their rings, but patriots dont.
"The flowers bloom, then wither... The stars shine and one day become extinct. This earth, the sun, the galaxies and even the big universe, someday will be destroyed. Compared with that, the human life is only a blink, just a little time. In that short time - people are born, laugh, cry, fight, are injured, feel joy, sadness, hate someone, love someone. All in just a moment. And then, are embraced by the eternal sleep called death."
post 1629662303 01-25-2021, 01:30 PM
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Originally Posted By Noliberals4⏩
WR's can age well if they condition themselves. Chris Carter, Jerry Rice, Tim Brown, etc. etc. aged like wine. Calvin Johnson was just all talent and no heart.
Lol no that's not it at all. There are some franchises that waste elite talent, and Detroit is one of them. Barry Sanders, Calvin Johnson, I'll even throw Stafford in there as he is sooo talented but surrounded by a chitty organization. This is why you can't compare.
post 1629662473 01-25-2021, 01:31 PM
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Yes. Basketball is easier to impact the game in 5v5 as it is anyhow, which has always allowed for more star power impact on team results than in football. Even though QB is the most impactful position in football, it's still harder to carry an NFL team than an NBA team.
post 1629662693 01-25-2021, 01:33 PM
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Originally Posted By Ken-O⏩
Its still the same answer, the bulls would get more affected than the Patriots. Bulls would have 0 rings yet the patriots would still have been dominant and have a few rings IMO.

So you overall change more with the removal of Jordan than you do with the removal of Brady. Bulls lose 100% of their rings, but patriots dont.
We can only know what they did do, and dominate is what they both did. It is speculation about what happens with them gone, aside from the time periods, 1 decade VS 2 decades. Statistically 2 decades has a higher number of championship runs than 1 does so part of what you are saying is elementary yet is only an observation of general statistics.
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post 1629663013 01-25-2021, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted By Noliberals4⏩
Second Super Bowl. Only time Patriots won by double digits in a Super Bowl.
i mean, it was 13 points, lol.
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post 1629663083 01-25-2021, 01:36 PM
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Originally Posted By nosirrahx⏩
We can only know what they did do, and dominate is what they both did. It is speculation about what happens with them gone, aside from the time periods, 1 decade VS 2 decades. Statistically 2 decades has a higher number of championship runs than 1 does so part of what you are saying is elementary yet is only an observation of general statistics.
Hey man, you brought up that argument, not me. Im just having fun with it.


Who loses more with the removal of the 2 players, the Bulls or the Patriots? Basketball or Football? To me the answer is clear.
"The flowers bloom, then wither... The stars shine and one day become extinct. This earth, the sun, the galaxies and even the big universe, someday will be destroyed. Compared with that, the human life is only a blink, just a little time. In that short time - people are born, laugh, cry, fight, are injured, feel joy, sadness, hate someone, love someone. All in just a moment. And then, are embraced by the eternal sleep called death."
post 1629663143 01-25-2021, 01:36 PM
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Originally Posted By Noliberals4⏩
No he didn't.
Yes he did.

His defense hold his ints tho.
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post 1629663313 01-25-2021, 01:38 PM
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I don't see the argument for Jordan over Brady. Brady's peak doesn't match Jordan but he has been doing it so much longer.
post 1629663373 01-25-2021, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted By umadbroski⏩
Yes he did.

His defense hold his ints tho.
Rodgers was making dumb mistakes like taking sacks on 3rd down (while Brady was converting 3rd downs).
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post 1629663393 01-25-2021, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted By Ken-O⏩
Its still the same answer, the bulls would get more affected than the Patriots. Bulls would have 0 rings yet the patriots would still have been dominant and have a few rings IMO.

So you overall change more with the removal of Jordan than you do with the removal of Brady. Bulls lose 100% of their rings, but patriots dont.
You just can't compare NBA and NFL players like this. An NBA player is one of five guys on a team who is on the floor for 90% of the game and impacts every single play both on offense and defense. A QB is only on the field for 50% of the game, and then is really only involved on passing plays which could only make up around 60% of the offensive plays (such as in yesterday's game). So obviously an NBA star will have a greater impact on the game than any NFL QB.
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post 1629663463 01-25-2021, 01:40 PM
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Originally Posted By Ken-O⏩
Hey man, you brought up that argument, not me. Im just having fun with it.


Who loses more with the removal of the 2 players, the Bulls or the Patriots? Basketball or Football? To me the answer is clear.
That is your question, not mine. I asked which sport has a bigger impact over 2 decades. Jordan gone impacts 1 decade, heavily, but not 2 decades.
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post 1629663733 01-25-2021, 01:42 PM
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I think he's on that level now
post 1629663833 01-25-2021, 01:43 PM
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Yes and as a Giants fan I hated him for the longest time. But I can no longer ignore his greatness or his accomplishments. The old man has made me a believer.
post 1629663913 01-25-2021, 01:43 PM
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Originally Posted By yeshli2nuts⏩
You just can't compare NBA and NFL players like this. An NBA player is one of five guys on a team who is on the floor for 90% of the game and impacts every single play both on offense and defense. A QB is only on the field for 50% of the game, and then is really only involved on passing plays which could only make up around 60% of the offensive plays (such as in yesterday's game). So obviously an NBA star will have a greater impact on the game than any NFL QB.
Well... thats kind of the point of this thread.

So you agree, Jordan is more GOAT than Brady at their respective sports.
Originally Posted By nosirrahx⏩
That is your question, not mine. I asked which sport has a bigger impact over 2 decades. Jordan gone impacts 1 decade, heavily, but not 2 decades.
Well, then every player that has played more years than Jordan will have a bigger impact than Jordan according to your logic. I mean, if you are going strictly by years that change with their removal, as in simply the time, yeah you are correct, obviously.

Championships wise, Bulls lose 100% of their rings, Patriots dont. IMO thats a far better criteria, especially because if you put any great QB on the patriots, they become contenders, you cant just put any great shooting guard on those bulls and expect them to be contenders.
"The flowers bloom, then wither... The stars shine and one day become extinct. This earth, the sun, the galaxies and even the big universe, someday will be destroyed. Compared with that, the human life is only a blink, just a little time. In that short time - people are born, laugh, cry, fight, are injured, feel joy, sadness, hate someone, love someone. All in just a moment. And then, are embraced by the eternal sleep called death."
post 1629664003 01-25-2021, 01:44 PM
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Originally Posted By squat_blaster⏩
Yes and as a Giants fan I hated him for the longest time. But I can no longer ignore his greatness or his accomplishments. The old man has made me a believer.
why would you hate him?

its not like you lose any SB to him.
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post 1629664263 01-25-2021, 01:45 PM
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post 1629664443 01-25-2021, 01:47 PM
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Originally Posted By Swept⏩
You can’t compare a basketball player to a football players


Brady doesn’t have the most mvp’s in his own sport.
He has the most that matter
post 1629664563 01-25-2021, 01:48 PM
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Originally Posted By Ken-O⏩
Well... thats kind of the point of this thread.

So you agree, Jordan is more GOAT than Brady at their respective sports.


Well, then every player that has played more years than Jordan will have a bigger impact than Jordan according to your logic. I mean, if you are going strictly by years that change with their removal, as in simply the time, yeah you are correct, obviously.

Championships wise, Bulls lose 100% of their rings, Patriots dont. IMO thats a far better criteria, especially because if you put any great QB on the patriots, they become contenders, you cant just put any great shooting guard on those bulls and expect them to be contenders.
I'm not disagreeing with your point, I was just making a different one. I can't think of a name or sport where the removal of 1 person changes 2 decades of history. As it is the list of names that change 1 decade is pretty damn short.
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post 1629664773 01-25-2021, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted By nosirrahx⏩
I'm not disagreeing with your point, I was just making a different one. I can't think of a name or sport where the removal of 1 person changes 2 decades of history. As it is the list of names that change 1 decade is pretty damn short.
Probably Tennis?

Which brings me to another point. IMO Tiger Woods and Federer are better GOATS at their respective sports than Brady at Football.
"The flowers bloom, then wither... The stars shine and one day become extinct. This earth, the sun, the galaxies and even the big universe, someday will be destroyed. Compared with that, the human life is only a blink, just a little time. In that short time - people are born, laugh, cry, fight, are injured, feel joy, sadness, hate someone, love someone. All in just a moment. And then, are embraced by the eternal sleep called death."
post 1629664873 01-25-2021, 01:51 PM
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I dont have a problem with brady tbh..

But i dont think this season quells the "system qb" stuff. Maybe some insinuate it was belicheck, while others insinuate it was his teams.. early on i guess it was largely his teams: welker, moss, etc., etc. But then later on patriots werent as good, but they were still pretty good. Im guessing thats when it switched to belicheck. If i remember right they went pretty run heavy for a bit. Around the stevan ridley time?

The bucs are stacked to all hell loll

Gronk (granted, old, but still a hof'er), antonio brown, evans, godwin

Id expect him to do well tbh. I just dont think this quells whether he benefits highly from those around him
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