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98,000 Public Schools; 13 Mass School Shootings In 60 Years
05-29-2022, 03:01 PM
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#91
https://www.fox23.com/news/trending/...LNR5QC3NRP6NY/
CHARLESTON, W.Va. — A woman fatally shot a man who was firing an AR-15-style rifle into a crowd of people that had gathered for a party in West Virginia, authorities said.
According to a news release from the Charleston Police Department, Dennis Butler, 37, of Charleston, was found at around 10:45 p.m. EDT Wednesday with multiple gunshot wounds, WSAZ-TV reported.
Butler was killed after he took out the rifle and began shooting at people attending a birthday-graduation party in Charleston, according to The Associated Press.
According to a news release from the Charleston Police Department, Dennis Butler, 37, of Charleston, was found at around 10:45 p.m. EDT Wednesday with multiple gunshot wounds, WSAZ-TV reported.
Butler was killed after he took out the rifle and began shooting at people attending a birthday-graduation party in Charleston, according to The Associated Press.
05-29-2022, 03:02 PM
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#92
- kingmanaverage
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Originally Posted By Antoine99⏩
If you go by number deaths then yeah plane crashes have more since plane crashes are on average far deadlier than mass shootings, but if we're comparing the number of fatal plane crashes in the US vs the number of mass shootings, the latter happens far more often.Adding to the airplane death statistic, the first thing people usually say to someone who is scared of flying is "Dying in a plane crash is extremely rare/you are more likely to win the lottery", which means that mass (or school I guess) shootings have even worse odds bordering on impossible
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05-29-2022, 03:07 PM
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#93
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Originally Posted By kingmanaverage⏩
Sure but how many Americans fly vs how many Americans go to schoolIf you go by number deaths then yeah plane crashes have more since plane crashes are on average far deadlier than mass shootings, but if we're comparing the number of fatal plane crashes in the US vs the number of mass shootings, the latter happens far more often.
Would kick em in the nuts
05-29-2022, 03:09 PM
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#94
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Look, in countries with heavy gun regulations, they share certain common characteristics that work for them:
a) largely culturally/ethnically homogenous populations (translation: society is willing to follow the laws and respect it)
b) a heavily militarized police force or security apparatus (ex. armed guards in public venues; police armed with automatic weapons etc)
c) a history of war/death/destruction on its territory (translation: people who have directly experienced war and its brutality are more amenable to gun restrictions because of past memories)
d) Conscription/mandatory military service (in many countries where mandatory military service is required, the desire to privately own weapons is diminished considerably because males in particular have to learn to use them. So basically weapons are seen as a tool and not as objects to covet or feel empowered with)
e) Early exposure to guns and teaching kids to respect them (in many countries, kids grow up side by side with weapons and their families/eders teach them how to handle it with care, show them how devastating they can be and basically tell kids to respect the weapons. They don't sugar coat the lethality of it and they don't hide them from it).
So what do we have in the States that applies to any of these conditions?
a) largely culturally/ethnically homogenous populations (translation: society is willing to follow the laws and respect it)
b) a heavily militarized police force or security apparatus (ex. armed guards in public venues; police armed with automatic weapons etc)
c) a history of war/death/destruction on its territory (translation: people who have directly experienced war and its brutality are more amenable to gun restrictions because of past memories)
d) Conscription/mandatory military service (in many countries where mandatory military service is required, the desire to privately own weapons is diminished considerably because males in particular have to learn to use them. So basically weapons are seen as a tool and not as objects to covet or feel empowered with)
e) Early exposure to guns and teaching kids to respect them (in many countries, kids grow up side by side with weapons and their families/eders teach them how to handle it with care, show them how devastating they can be and basically tell kids to respect the weapons. They don't sugar coat the lethality of it and they don't hide them from it).
So what do we have in the States that applies to any of these conditions?
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05-29-2022, 03:14 PM
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#95
Originally Posted By zknarc⏩
Agree. However what seems to happen in practice is that the media reports the number for something in whatever way makes it seem more important- if a percentage sounds more impressive they report a percentage, if a straight number sounds bigger they go with that.I feel like when stats are reported (eg. covid deaths) they need to be put in context with another relatable stat for reference so people can evaluate the numbers being presented in a relative way otherwise it is purely abstract.
Many numbers, especially with a large population like the USA, sound scary but compared with events like being struck by lightning, dying of flu or dying in a traffic accident in a normal year they might not be.
Many numbers, especially with a large population like the USA, sound scary but compared with events like being struck by lightning, dying of flu or dying in a traffic accident in a normal year they might not be.
Originally Posted By AncientYouth⏩
Worth noting. Also the relationship between the US and many of these countries [drug cartels, illegal immigration]. Then consider about half of the US gun related fatalities are suicides.Countries with the Highest Total Gun Deaths (all causes) in 2019
Brazil — 49,436
United States — 37,038
Venezuela — 28,515
Mexico — 22,116
India — 14,710
Colombia — 13,169
Philippines — 9,267
Guatemala — 5,980
Brazil — 49,436
United States — 37,038
Venezuela — 28,515
Mexico — 22,116
India — 14,710
Colombia — 13,169
Philippines — 9,267
Guatemala — 5,980
Originally Posted By AgRyan⏩
Agree.Because it's using statistical anomalies in order to justify forcing your personal beliefs on millions of people because you're prying on emotions...
Drunk driving kills around 10,000 people a year, hundreds being children. Easy solution is to make cars have an ignition interlock, at least requiring it during night time hours. No one is pushing for that though.There's tons of examples like this. It's not about saving lives, it's about political agendas and emotions.
Drunk driving kills around 10,000 people a year, hundreds being children. Easy solution is to make cars have an ignition interlock, at least requiring it during night time hours. No one is pushing for that though.There's tons of examples like this. It's not about saving lives, it's about political agendas and emotions.
Originally Posted By TealCat⏩
By your own statement the logical response would be to reduce or eliminate "incel psychopaths". And I understand the impulse to try and ban guns.Yeah, the families of these victims are focused on political agendas. Give me a fkn break.
Again phgt, no one says "I want to take as many innocent lives as possible, let me go drink and drive."
We are seeing a rising trend of incel psychopaths (whose demographics are increasing at an unprecedented rate due to societal degradation) who openly admit to wanting to take as many lives as possible as quickly as possible, often with minimal effort, which is what we have with Sandy Hook and Uvalde.
Our response to these tragedies is truly a litmus test of our moral fiber and character as a nation, statistical anomaly or not. Once was one time too many, here we are 10 years later.
Again phgt, no one says "I want to take as many innocent lives as possible, let me go drink and drive."
We are seeing a rising trend of incel psychopaths (whose demographics are increasing at an unprecedented rate due to societal degradation) who openly admit to wanting to take as many lives as possible as quickly as possible, often with minimal effort, which is what we have with Sandy Hook and Uvalde.
Our response to these tragedies is truly a litmus test of our moral fiber and character as a nation, statistical anomaly or not. Once was one time too many, here we are 10 years later.
Do you truly believe that there is a real possibility of that working? That by writing down some words that individuals who are in kamikaze mode [planning to die] will just shrug it off?
I bet if you try at all you yourself could think up at least 2 or 3 ways to kill a bunch of unarmed people and yourself without the need for any sort of gun.
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05-29-2022, 03:16 PM
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#96
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Originally Posted By TealCat⏩
Yeah... the families of the victims are focused on their emotions, which was directly after "political agendas", but you, like it seems like you generally do, focus on one part that you can argue in favor of or against to back your point, instead of actually discussing anything worth discussing.Yeah, the families of these victims are focused on political agendas. Give me a fkn break.
Again phgt, no one says "I want to take as many innocent lives as possible, let me go drink and drive."
We are seeing a rising trend of incel psychopaths (whose demographics are increasing at an unprecedented rate due to societal degradation) who openly admit to wanting to take as many lives as possible as quickly as possible, often with minimal effort, which is what we have with Sandy Hook and Uvalde.
Our response to these tragedies is truly a litmus test of our moral fiber and character as a nation, statistical anomaly or not. Once was one time too many, here we are 10 years later.
Again phgt, no one says "I want to take as many innocent lives as possible, let me go drink and drive."
We are seeing a rising trend of incel psychopaths (whose demographics are increasing at an unprecedented rate due to societal degradation) who openly admit to wanting to take as many lives as possible as quickly as possible, often with minimal effort, which is what we have with Sandy Hook and Uvalde.
Our response to these tragedies is truly a litmus test of our moral fiber and character as a nation, statistical anomaly or not. Once was one time too many, here we are 10 years later.
If it's about saving lives, it shouldn't matter what the motivation was behind the incident, just to get the amount of deaths down.
Right now, mass shootings are the path of least resistance to inflicting mass casualties and getting attention, getting a rush, whatever it is. Lets say every single gun suddenly disappears, right now. These "incel psychopaths" will resort to biological weapons (which are extremely easy to make and cause even more casualties), vehicles, whatever else it is. Making guns disappear doesn't solve this problem.
People getting killed is sad, but it's wrong to react emotionally instead of logically. Arguing with emotion is generally pretty stupid. I'm not even a big 2A supporter or gun nut, but the emotional and then political response to these incidents are always overblown, then people like you act like they're arguing from a position of "moral fiber" and everyone who opposes their view lacks that. It's dumb.
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05-29-2022, 04:14 PM
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#97
- Johnez
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Originally Posted By TealCat⏩
And neither do law abiding citizens who own guns. And yet you want to take away a right enshrined in the founding documents over 200 years ago. Why?Again phgt, no one says "I want to take as many innocent lives as possible, let me go drink and drive."
Virtue is its own reward.
05-29-2022, 04:35 PM
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#98
- jackamo2887
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The "ban all guns" solution may be the best, or not, who knows..the problem is it isn't at all feasible.
If the government repealed the 2nd amendment..a best case scenario is a black market is created and criminals still get guns and kill each other.
The worst case scenario is a full blown Civil War breaks out.
Banning alcohol didn't stop people from getting it. Banning weed didn't stop people from getting it, etc. There are millions of guns in circulation, you can't confiscate them all.
I think a psyche test should be mandatory to buy one though. That is a start.
If the government repealed the 2nd amendment..a best case scenario is a black market is created and criminals still get guns and kill each other.
The worst case scenario is a full blown Civil War breaks out.
Banning alcohol didn't stop people from getting it. Banning weed didn't stop people from getting it, etc. There are millions of guns in circulation, you can't confiscate them all.
I think a psyche test should be mandatory to buy one though. That is a start.
Survival. When the jungle tears itself down and builds itself into something new. Guys like you and me, we end up dead. Doesn’t really mean anything. Or, if we happen to live through it, well that doesn’t mean anything either.
05-29-2022, 05:01 PM
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#99
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Originally Posted By TealCat⏩
Honestly, no, it's not something I'd considered. I think most who've dealt with suicide would say it's as big a tragedy as there is, but I do appreciate your perspective.lol'd at "Good stuff Katya."
rage.gif at bolded
Did it ever cross your mind that there's a huge difference between someone wanting to die and someone who doesn't?
rage.gif at bolded
Did it ever cross your mind that there's a huge difference between someone wanting to die and someone who doesn't?
Never thought I'd see the day where I'm agreeing with P51 over most of my fellow conservative miscers.
LOL. Been there. Enjoy it while it lasts. One of my favorite things is the surprise times you agree with someone you are almost always at odds with.Katya is a pseudo-intellectual with an empty egg carton.
This personal attack seems so incongruous with the quote in your sig. Snails was loved because she was kind to everyone. If you really want to honor her memory, be kind.Katya and I are both parents and have skin in the game. My opinions are not arrived at lightly. I can tell this is a subject you care about deeply and you should know that I care too, even though I see things differently.
MFC
05-29-2022, 06:01 PM
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#100
Originally Posted By jackamo2887⏩
Would you be opposed to a psyche test to vote or exercise freedom of speech? What about to buy alcohol?The "ban all guns" solution may be the best, or not, who knows..the problem is it isn't at all feasible.
If the government repealed the 2nd amendment..a best case scenario is a black market is created and criminals still get guns and kill each other.
The worst case scenario is a full blown Civil War breaks out.
Banning alcohol didn't stop people from getting it. Banning weed didn't stop people from getting it, etc. There are millions of guns in circulation, you can't confiscate them all.
I think a psyche test should be mandatory to buy one though. That is a start.
If the government repealed the 2nd amendment..a best case scenario is a black market is created and criminals still get guns and kill each other.
The worst case scenario is a full blown Civil War breaks out.
Banning alcohol didn't stop people from getting it. Banning weed didn't stop people from getting it, etc. There are millions of guns in circulation, you can't confiscate them all.
I think a psyche test should be mandatory to buy one though. That is a start.
05-30-2022, 05:06 AM
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#101
- kingmanaverage
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Originally Posted By Antoine99⏩
Fair point.Sure but how many Americans fly vs how many Americans go to school
“Steroids is now just a word that the lazy and ignorant use to describe any guy that has more muscle and dedication than them”– Mike O'Hearn
"I am like getting the feeling of cumming in the gym; I'm getting the feeling of cumming at home; I'm getting the feeling of cumming backstage; when I pump up, when I pose out in front of 5000 people I get the same feeling, so I am cumming day and night. It's terrific, right? So you know, I am in heaven."
05-30-2022, 05:30 AM
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#102
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Originally Posted By katya422⏩
Comparing school shootings to aviation injuries is quite possibly the biggest strawman argument I've ever seen but I think you know this, but allowed yourself commit such a fallacy anyway for some reasonHere is a link to the researchers' data base if you want to check that out:
https://www.theviolenceproject.org/m...oter-database/
Something can be rare and terrible at the same time. It IS rare.
Too bad prohibition has been tried and failed.
illegal booze = people going blind/dying from bad bootleg hooch
illegal drugs = ******** ODs
We can only do so much to make the public safe when there is a profit motive to give the people what they want. Probably the best REAL solution is to improve human psychology and living conditions so that people are less interested in abusing substances.
What level of government control do you believe would be required to reduce mass violence incidents to a level you deem acceptable?
And are you okay with surrendering freedom to acquire the safety you *believe* that our corrupt [undeniable] government would actually provide for you?
I linked the data base above. Please feel free to figure that out and report back. Per the article:
- 13 mass school shootings
- 146 children and adults killed
- An additional 182 children and adults injured
The first one they record was Stockton, CA in 1989.
If you look at aircraft related fatalities from 1989 through 2019 there were 38,356 fatalities 13,360 severe injuries and 21,383 minor injuries.
https://www.psbr.law/aviation_accident_statistics.html
38,356 fatalities flying planes vs. 146 fatalities from mass school shootings
34,743 injuries flying planes vs. 182 injuries from mass school shootings
Yes, it is nuts to risk decreasing the mental health and well being of all school children in an attempt to protect some unknown small number of children from a crazy person who could find some other way to murder students.
- remote learning [kids falling behind/checked out]
- masks [children not as socially/mentally developed as they should be]
- barriers and physical distancing [teaching children to be afraid of human contact]
Putting police in schools and/or making school a place where children feel unsafe is problematic.
Of course no one wants their children to be murdered by some maniac. Do you want them to be arrested for spaghetti straps? Spit balls? Property damage?
https://www.theviolenceproject.org/m...oter-database/
Something can be rare and terrible at the same time. It IS rare.
Too bad prohibition has been tried and failed.
illegal booze = people going blind/dying from bad bootleg hooch
illegal drugs = ******** ODs
We can only do so much to make the public safe when there is a profit motive to give the people what they want. Probably the best REAL solution is to improve human psychology and living conditions so that people are less interested in abusing substances.
What level of government control do you believe would be required to reduce mass violence incidents to a level you deem acceptable?
And are you okay with surrendering freedom to acquire the safety you *believe* that our corrupt [undeniable] government would actually provide for you?
I linked the data base above. Please feel free to figure that out and report back. Per the article:
- 13 mass school shootings
- 146 children and adults killed
- An additional 182 children and adults injured
The first one they record was Stockton, CA in 1989.
If you look at aircraft related fatalities from 1989 through 2019 there were 38,356 fatalities 13,360 severe injuries and 21,383 minor injuries.
https://www.psbr.law/aviation_accident_statistics.html
38,356 fatalities flying planes vs. 146 fatalities from mass school shootings
34,743 injuries flying planes vs. 182 injuries from mass school shootings
Yes, it is nuts to risk decreasing the mental health and well being of all school children in an attempt to protect some unknown small number of children from a crazy person who could find some other way to murder students.
- remote learning [kids falling behind/checked out]
- masks [children not as socially/mentally developed as they should be]
- barriers and physical distancing [teaching children to be afraid of human contact]
Putting police in schools and/or making school a place where children feel unsafe is problematic.
Of course no one wants their children to be murdered by some maniac. Do you want them to be arrested for spaghetti straps? Spit balls? Property damage?
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