Indeed. Me and wife were just talking about how memorial day weekend is around the corner. All down hill for the rest of the year from there. Amazing how slow it seems like some days can go by yet years fly.

I expect sig to issue a safety recall, not a "voluntary upgrade".

Labeling it as a mandatory safety recall WILL significantly increase the number of pistols that get fixed and stop being unsafe.

People were drop testing loads of different manufacturers guns after the P320 thing. Notice how nothing has came of it.

The other manufacturers seem secure in their non-**** guns.

Don't worry, these guys have you covered. Lots of other pistols have been tested in every conceivable drop fashion including exactly the way the Sig fails by all kinds of people. Just think about the hits on your YouTube channel if you discovered that ___ had the same problem as the P320 and were 'first to market' lol.

It's just Sig that sucks, makes unsafe firearms, and then pretends it's okay...their marketing campaign for the P320 is ****ing gold right now though lol you'll take it from here, huh? Riiiiight

dfw when they prob had a design team who had an outsources engineering consultant who doesnt work for sig in house. who do they fire the designer or the engineer who signed off on it?

of course this is speculation but alot of big companies just outsorce engineering cause cheaper than having a full time staffer

think this just adds fuel to the hammer fire vs striker fire debate

I would imagine a company the size of Sig can easily afford to have an entire board of engineers on staff.

Well I already stated they should have labeled it as such. Guess we'll just have to wait and see if a leaked or estimated number is ever released for how many were sent back. I'm thinking a Sig must have touched you inappropriately at some point in your life with all that angst though.

I was never dumb enough to buy a sig lol. Only ever wanted striker guns, rented a P320 and it sucked (mentioned it in here with pics at the time), so I had no interest in it (because it sucked).

But being around guns that might kill me if they get dropped or knocked on the floor isn't very appealing. I've seen my share of loaded pistols get dropped at the range or at classes, and there are unfortunately a lot of P320's out there that I am sure won't be fix..errr..."upgraded"...only a matter of time until somebody literally dies because guns are dangerous and guns kill people accidentally. Thanks, Sig.

I'm sorry, chin up man. One thing that's stuck with me when someone who is very close to me lost their parent is: No one can dodge death, it's inevitable, but if there's one thing I wish for all my loved ones is, if they are to pass away, I hope they pass away with the least amount of pain and sufferingprimary arms sells TLR-1 HL for 120. Armsunlimited/armsunlisted has the TLR for a good price along with the surefire x300.

From a safety, health, and life perspective, sig should have dealt and handled this more seriously, as in a very serious recall, BUT...

Business is business and it would be the biggest sting had they done that (made the problem out to be as big as it should be), but rather they deescalate the problem (this needs to be seriously bolded) by trying to play it off as less serious, which is bothering a lot of people obviously.

The biggest sting may yet bet a lawsuit or lawsuits when one of the supposedly safe and not upgraded sigs kills somebody.

morning crew
just watched the video of the statue being taken down by protesters...with the sherriff's dept. standing by idly.
interesting times

I think they hurt their reputation, even prior to the P320 mess, by trying to branch out and expand too quickly. I'm sure it's made them a lot more money, but they've developed a lot of handguns and more than should be expected from a top of the line company have had reliability issues. Their P22X series has always been top tier and they should have done what was necessary to keep that track record. I only have a P229 and a 522 rifle and both have excellent quality and reliability. A lot of the rest of their line up I wouldn't put above any of the other mid level brands.

Some on the gun boards have been saying, now more than ever, they won't have anything to do with the US made sigs...just the more traditional hammer fired overseas manufactured. I'll just avoid all of them still don't like the bore axis on those, and hated the P320 I rented, can't think of any reason I'd want any of their guns even before this issue lol

What's going to be next? Dig up the graves of the Civil War fallen from the Confederacy?

They're trying to start a new Civil War by knocking down statues from the last Civil War

RIP Sig

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2...ems-questions/

The following is the opinion of the author, and his alone. It does not represent the views of The Firearm Blog or any other TFB staff member. But I bet it represents the views of many of our readers.

I think SIG owes the gun world some answers. We’ve seen behavior from them over the past nine days that is not only unbecoming of a major manufacturer (such as lying to a major police department), but bizarre and inexplicable (such as saying drop safeties “legitimize mishandling”). And so, we have questions.

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SIG chose to design the P320 as a striker-fired handgun with a relatively high mass metal trigger with no trigger safety – despite the fact that this safety feature has been included on almost every striker-fired handgun since the 1970s. Why? Trigger safeties are ugly, but functional and if designed properly do not interfere with the trigger’s feel. Did SIG leave this off the firearm for aesthetic, or maybe cost reasons? Did they believe the gun would sell better with a trigger that looked more “SIG” than “Glock”? Why was such an obvious safety feature omitted from a firearm that clearly needed it?

When the decision was made to omit this feature – and this decision was consciously made at some point, as SIG initially advertised a trigger safety as an option for the P320 – was any testing involved? Did SIG make this decision sight unseen without even determining its impact to the pistol’s safety characteristics, or – worse – did they make the decision in spite of evidence that it would reduce the gun’s safety?

At what point during the Modular Handgun System program did the drop safety issue resurface? Was it before or after their pistol was selected by the Army to be the M17? Did the US Army request the changes to the trigger’s design, or did SIG make these changes on their own? Why didn’t SIG begin rolling out P320s with safety triggers – which they had already designed – at this point in time, instead of waiting for it to blow up in their face?

How long has SIG known about Vincent Sheperis’ injury, which occurred eight months ago? It seems difficult to believe that SIG would not be promptly notified about this incident, so have they known their pistol’s defect had already caused someone injury for that entire time, without notifying the public? If so, why didn’t they speak up then?

When the Dallas Police Department rescinded authorization to use the P320, why didn’t SIG take that opportunity to admit the issue and make the changes they already had in the pipeline? Why convince the Dallas PD they were mistaken about an issue that SIG was obviously fully aware of at the time? Why lie, especially when the issue is so easy for third parties to independently verify? If anything, the Dallas PD’s announcement would seem to me to be the ideal time for SIG to come clean: A prompt, honest response would throw light on SIG as a company that takes user concerns seriously and acts quickly to fix them, and it doesn’t hurt that the recall occurred after Glock’s MHS protest had been rejected, either. It’s not like doing this would have been more expensive or difficult for SIG. The company appears to have had already arranged the media event announcing the MHS trigger upgrade, around or even before the time of the Dallas PD’s decision. So why not then?

SIG’s actual behavior has had the opposite effect, though. It makes one wonder: If SIG will dismiss the complaints of one of the largest police departments in the country – complaints about a problem they have known is real for months, possibly since before the pistol was even released – then how will the company treat the average Joe who has a problem? What does it say about a company whose CEO not only believes safety features just encourage negligence, but will say that publicly during a media event as part of damage control for a drop safety scandal?

I am not SIG’s enemy. I stood up for SIG and called out Glock’s narrative about MHS, even though I personally prefer Glock handguns. However, SIG’s practices and behavior – not just over the past few days but since even before the P320’s release – compel me to ask the question: What the heck are you guys thinking, SIG?

Is there something about striker-fired pistols that necessitates a "safe action" trigger design?

Seems to depend on the specific pistol, such as how much mass the trigger itself has, pull weight, and pull distance...not every single striker pistol has the trigger dingus

Well. Yeah. With a trigger safety, it is absolutely impossible for a dropped gun's trigger to move rearward without something physically engaging the trigger safety. Especially if your dumb as fuk like sig and make the trigger weigh enough for just that to happen if dropped.

It's just become standard because it's a lighter pull than a DA trigger. ND's when holstering/unholstering created a panic.

That said, a safe action trigger is completely different than a drop safe trigger, which every gun should have.


Edit: I suppose it isn't completely different, depending on the manufacturer. In many cases they are the same.

Definitely seems like Sig may have shot themselves in the foot.

Thing is the design of, say, Glock is just fuking brilliant as far as safeties go. No matter how you go at it, a Glock absolutely, positively, CANNOT fire unless the trigger is physically pulled back by a physically object. Gaston's safety system is just fuking brilliant.

Concur.

The only gun forum I visit is the Beretta forum. A great forum, really, but you should hear them talk about Glocks. It's like they, specifically, caused every American tragedy ever.

Farley you ask why sig? Although I've never touched nor shot one, all the people comparing between the Glock 19 and P320 say two things that lead them to favor the p320.. first is because of the night sights that it comes with and it not being plastic, the second being the feeling of the gun is supposedly better with the sig.

I believe the second reason isn't the second main reason, I just can't remember it off the top of my head but a lot of people have said it feels better. I can't answer that or say anything about that as I've never held one but people like you and others in this thread who have gotten their hands on both or shot both can shed light on this instead.

It really is a classic case of haters gonna hate/insecurity. Everybody knows Glocks are far more popular and common, and just as good as (if not better than), their favorite, and it irks them. Everywhere they go, everything they do, everybody they talk to, it's Glock this Glock that my Glock do you have a Glock you should get a Glock because GLOCK so they get mad lol

There are plenty of fine pistols out there, but the standard for a polymer striker pistol is the Glock. And fanboys of other brands hate it lol

I don't prefer any of the factory night sights anyway, I have always put my preference of night sights on so I would rather buy the pistol with cheap plastic sights that don't add to the cost of the gun and are very easy to take off (Ameriglo Operator Pro in the past, Trijicon HD now).

The 'feel' of the gun is entirely subjective and will vary from person to person, and I'm sure what you are used to will be a factor, but I HATED the way the P320 shot. I shot it back to back with a couple Glocks and I forget either an FNS or a VP9, but the Sig was the only one that pointed and shot like ****...the FNS, Glock, VP9, Shield, an M&P I shot, all pointed and shot fine (though the M&P Trigger was aids). The 320 was just plain wrong. But I was used to all those other polymer pistols, if you went in cold without enough experience to matter on the others and shot the 320 first, it might be the opposite.

Specifically the 320 I rented pointed so low I couldn't see the front sight when I presented the pistol, whereas all those others went pretty much on target with the sights lined up one the same as the other, or close enough. Trigger was nothing special either, and the dimensions of the grip vs slide and the balance just felt stupid.

The main mod there is from GA, not far from Smyrna, and has the most rustled of jimmies. lol

brb it's tupperware
brb Mushy trigger
brb block

lmao

The most popular and common guns right now are tupperware though lol. Is he a 1911 fudd or something?

All Beretta 92 fanboys. I mean they're great guns, I have several myself...but they all only like hammer fired, all metal guns.

But wait a minute, when Beretta intro'd the APX this year, suddenly there was a common ground, lol. "But this one has Italian sex appeal!"


It's just typical Glock hate. They're all really good, smart, gun loving people....but they lose their total chit when someone dares utter the "G" word.