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Property is NOT how you make money..srs
01-12-2018, 11:07 AM
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#121
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Originally Posted By milesgiles1⏩
Thanx brah'member you from Ironman/Musclemag back in the day, humbled to have you up in this thread..
(he really is an industry insider btw..but we cant talk about that..)
(he really is an industry insider btw..but we cant talk about that..)
Originally Posted By milesgiles1⏩
Of course, but is there really anything that does not apply to investment wise? I wouldn't recommend people put all their $ into realestate just as i wouldn't tell them to put all their $ in the stock market, and so forth. Usual factors being equal (timing, location, etc) real estate can be an excellent investment. Historically speaking, real estate has been one of the safer investments, but there are rules one has to follow, as they do for any investment, like don't buy in a bubble ignoring that bubble gonna pop ugly. Me, I stopped looking at any property early/mid 2000s as it was obvious it was a bubble and a bubble that was gonna be ugly. I was never upside down on any property but got close during the worst of it, and the rebound has seen vales exceed the bubble. Why, I made smart purchases with an open ended time frame, vs any thoughts of quick flip that got so many into trouble. So much so, I cashed out of my main place that was in Metro MA, and moved to FL to put solid liquid $ into an account, but 2 places in cash, etc.*The timeframe on a your return is, lets be honest, determined largely by luck. Whilst RE has overall outpaced many other investments, there have been two big collapses in values in the last 30 years, and if you bought the wrong side of those a decent investment either cleaned you out or you spent a very long time regaining what you have lost.
Originally Posted By milesgiles1⏩
Exactly.So yeah, if you bought after the sub prime, it looks (at the moment) like a phenomenal medium term investment. Averaged over the whole 30 years (a typical mortgage) it becomes a decent long term investment
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01-12-2018, 01:28 PM
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#122
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Originally Posted By arn710⏩
Cheers, here's one that stuck in my mind..OP is absolutely correct and not a single person ITT has provided any evidence to the contrary
I've seen the posts OP is talking about. They aren't as common as they used to be. The financial calculations and speculation are laughable at best
I've seen the posts OP is talking about. They aren't as common as they used to be. The financial calculations and speculation are laughable at best
(Posted by nosirrahx middle of last year..)
"The building I am currently looking at is a 2 family for $189k. I am going to offer cash $169k and likely settle on $179k. Renovated it will be about $30K so lets call it $210k. Rent in that area is $1250 but lets be a nice guy like you and only charge $1000.
So $2000 a month X 12 months means I am collecting $24,000 a year. My brother owns a duplex on the same street and pays about $3000 a year on maintenance (does most of that himself) and taxes.
Lets go to crazy town and call the expenses $5000 leaving $19,000 a year. Lets now pretend that your crystal ball that tells you that our housing market will crash but for some reason can't help you make $ is right and I lose 50% on the value of the duplex and for the hell of it lets also pretend that renovations do not factor in.
Now the duplex is worth 90K and I am taking in $19,000 a year all with numbers that are exaggerated to a ridiculously pessimistic degree. $210k-$90k= $120k. $120k/$19k=6.13 years but lets round that up to 10 years because we should stay consistent with using moron math.
So if catastrophe strikes, I charge "nice guy" rent and assume that everything goes impossibly wrong this takes 10 years to turn out OK."
Hilarious
01-12-2018, 01:37 PM
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#123
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house prices might go down but rent always stays high esp if your in a big city or suburb within 10-20 mins of the city
01-12-2018, 01:59 PM
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#124
Originally Posted By milesgiles1⏩
You find land to develop. You acquire the proper permits and such to build. There’s going to be schools or a college built a few miles away plus shopping centers. You contact sophisticated and accredited investors, pitch your idea and see if they bite. Most will. They give you money to start building on the land you put a deposit on. They expect a ROI that you both agreed to in a contract.Hold on squire..have you bought the land or not? I think you are saying you buy land and hope for an investor to find a developer to zone it and you sell for more than you paid??
I mean, if that's what you are saying you aren't wrong, but it doesn't answer my two questions, how do you know what land is going to become valuable, and how to you raise the initial deposit?
If you mean something else entirely please explain
I mean, if that's what you are saying you aren't wrong, but it doesn't answer my two questions, how do you know what land is going to become valuable, and how to you raise the initial deposit?
If you mean something else entirely please explain
01-12-2018, 02:06 PM
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#125
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Originally Posted By IH8RICE⏩
Sounds like a, you know, “job”You find land to develop. You acquire the proper permits and such to build. There’s going to be schools or a college built a few miles away plus shopping centers. You contact sophisticated and accredited investors, pitch your idea and see if they bite. Most will. They give you money to start building on the land you put a deposit on. They expect a ROI that you both agreed to in a contract.
Which is OPs point
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01-12-2018, 02:11 PM
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#126
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Originally Posted By IH8RICE⏩
For a worthwhile development in a good area you are surely talking millions of $, not to mention god knows how many more $ to find that plot..You find land to develop. You acquire the proper permits and such to build. There’s going to be schools or a college built a few miles away plus shopping centers. You contact sophisticated and accredited investors, pitch your idea and see if they bite. Most will. They give you money to start building on the land you put a deposit on. They expect a ROI that you both agreed to in a contract.
01-12-2018, 02:14 PM
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#127
Originally Posted By milesgiles1⏩
My favorite part is how all of the fees associated with buying and selling a property are always left out as if they're just something you pull out of your pocket.Cheers, here's one that stuck in my mind..
(Posted by nosirrahx middle of last year..)
Hilarious
(Posted by nosirrahx middle of last year..)
Hilarious
Another favorite of mine, we've seen it several times ITT already, is people that have had BS appraisals thrown at them and repeat them as if someone is standing at their door with a suitcase full of cash. Conveniently, these folks also leave out the fees associated with buying and selling a property
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01-12-2018, 02:15 PM
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#128
Originally Posted By Hammersia⏩
A job means you’re working for someone. A business is something you are in control of which this is. Normally people operate under an llc for projects such as this.Sounds like a, you know, “job”
Which is OPs point
Which is OPs point
Originally Posted By milesgiles1⏩
And?For a worthwhile development in a good area you are surely talking millions of $, not to mention god knows how many more $ to find that plot..
01-12-2018, 02:27 PM
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#129
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Originally Posted By IH8RICE⏩
in the real world, not misc fantasy land, that's an investment for an already very wealthy individual or more likely an experienced corporation. Without the liquid, it's not happening.A job means you’re working for someone. A business is something you are in control of which this is. Normally people operate under an llc for projects such as this.
And?
And?
01-12-2018, 02:29 PM
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#130
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Originally Posted By arn710⏩
Yep. There's actually a better one by that hobbit Ashin, reckons he can rent out his 9k trailer in a forest for..900 a month (!!) . Not going to look for it his posts make me physically ill from the stupidity.My favorite part is how all of the fees associated with buying and selling a property are always left out as if they're just something you pull out of your pocket.
Another favorite of mine, we've seen it several times ITT already, is people that have had BS appraisals thrown at them and repeat them as if someone is standing at their door with a suitcase full of cash. Conveniently, these folks also leave out the fees associated with buying and selling a property
Another favorite of mine, we've seen it several times ITT already, is people that have had BS appraisals thrown at them and repeat them as if someone is standing at their door with a suitcase full of cash. Conveniently, these folks also leave out the fees associated with buying and selling a property
01-12-2018, 02:30 PM
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#131
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I plan on going balls deep in prop in the next year or so.
before you ask how I got the cash - crypto
how much did I start with - less than 5k
currently in the 6 figs.
I'm prob a big outlier tho so take it what you will.
before you ask how I got the cash - crypto
how much did I start with - less than 5k
currently in the 6 figs.
I'm prob a big outlier tho so take it what you will.
LA misc crew
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01-12-2018, 02:35 PM
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#132
Originally Posted By milesgiles1⏩
Ok, ill do something lower on the scale. There’s a college located near downtown and there are apartment complexes you want to buy to rent to college students. You’ve got a killer deal and you need one or two investors to put up the extra liquid you need to get the place plus upgrades to drive rents. Investors invest a few hundred thousand and expect a ROI until they’re paid back in full.in the real world, not misc fantasy land, that's an investment for an already very wealthy individual or more likely an experienced corporation. Without the liquid, it's not happening.
01-12-2018, 02:35 PM
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#133
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Originally Posted By KoCorl⏩
Good, you prove the point. Acquire cash first, then invest accordingly. The more cash, the better the mortgage terms, for a start.I plan on going balls deep in prop in the next year or so.
before you ask how I got the cash - crypto
how much did I start with - less than 5k
currently in the 6 figs.
I'm prob a big outlier tho so take it what you will.
before you ask how I got the cash - crypto
how much did I start with - less than 5k
currently in the 6 figs.
I'm prob a big outlier tho so take it what you will.
01-12-2018, 02:37 PM
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#134
Originally Posted By milesgiles1⏩
Maybe I’m misunderstanding you. Are you talking about a person starting from scratch or one that’s been in the business for a few years and is ready to jump into something bigger?Good, you prove the point. Acquire cash first, then invest accordingly. The more cash, the better the mortgage terms, for a start.
01-12-2018, 02:39 PM
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#135
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OP is right but misc is mostly basic bitches/normies who think they are balling off 12% a year in interest (if that)
ive made 5000% per year in cyrpto since 2014 and i havent had to leave my computer chair to do it
stay mad real estate investors. lol
ive made 5000% per year in cyrpto since 2014 and i havent had to leave my computer chair to do it
stay mad real estate investors. lol
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01-12-2018, 02:49 PM
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#136
Originally Posted By RightKindaGuy⏩
No one is mad. Congrats. Completely different type of investment that isn’t even comparable on most levels...OP is right but misc is mostly basic bitches/normies who think they are balling off 12% a year in interest (if that)
ive made 5000% per year in cyrpto since 2014 and i havent had to leave my computer chair to do it
stay mad real estate investors. lol
ive made 5000% per year in cyrpto since 2014 and i havent had to leave my computer chair to do it
stay mad real estate investors. lol
01-12-2018, 02:51 PM
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#137
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Originally Posted By RightKindaGuy⏩
Real world RE returns are a hell of a lot less than 12%..OP is right but misc is mostly basic bitches/normies who think they are balling off 12% a year in interest (if that)
ive made 5000% per year in cyrpto since 2014 and i havent had to leave my computer chair to do it
stay mad real estate investors. lol
ive made 5000% per year in cyrpto since 2014 and i havent had to leave my computer chair to do it
stay mad real estate investors. lol
01-12-2018, 02:57 PM
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#138
- milesgiles1
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Originally Posted By IH8RICE⏩
I'm saying unless you start with a lot of capital, RE is a very, very slow burn. As with most investments, more capital opens up more and varied opportunities with the chance of higher returns.Maybe I’m misunderstanding you. Are you talking about a person starting from scratch or one that’s been in the business for a few years and is ready to jump into something bigger?
You can grow a lot of wealth, slowly, with RE..but don't try it without the wealth in the first place
01-12-2018, 03:10 PM
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#139
Originally Posted By milesgiles1⏩
I owe you a rep. Wish you would’ve said this in your OP, srs.I'm saying unless you start with a lot of capital, RE is a very, very slow burn. As with most investments, more capital opens up more and varied opportunities with the chance of higher returns.
You can grow a lot of wealth, slowly, with RE..but don't try it without the wealth in the first place
You can grow a lot of wealth, slowly, with RE..but don't try it without the wealth in the first place
01-12-2018, 03:23 PM
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#140
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Originally Posted By IH8RICE⏩
No problem at all. Blimey has the misc reached detente?I owe you a rep. Wish you would’ve said this in your OP, srs.
01-12-2018, 03:43 PM
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#141
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Originally Posted By TrotonKat⏩
Are you actually on drugs? Srs. Very.You need to start saving cash asap so you have a decent deposit. You look around for areas that are being built up and it would be very rare for a block of land to decrease in value
Your posts don't have anything to do with anything I've written, but then you manage to argue with yourself as well. I mean, you have quantum theory in your sig, but then just post word salad in response to very simple arguments. It's like there is no train of thought you are following?
01-12-2018, 04:23 PM
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#142
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I just made over 40k on a property I bought 2 years ago. Some of the easiest money I ever made
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01-12-2018, 08:52 PM
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#143
Originally Posted By milesgiles1⏩
10% appreciation of an asset doesn't include the additional Net Income of the business or depreciation.A moderately successful small business or side hustle is going to return a lot more than 10% if it's at all scaleable.
Will look up long term average property price rises when not on mobile. Think in the uk it's probably in the 6-7% range over 40 years, and probably less in the States. For an average guy on an average salary, that isn't going to make you rich. Comfortable yes, but not rich.
Will look up long term average property price rises when not on mobile. Think in the uk it's probably in the 6-7% range over 40 years, and probably less in the States. For an average guy on an average salary, that isn't going to make you rich. Comfortable yes, but not rich.
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01-12-2018, 09:18 PM
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#144
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Originally Posted By milesgiles1⏩
What makes real estate an attractive investment is that you can put down just a fraction of the cost of a property upfront and start earning income off it right away once you get renters in, while not having to pay it back until LONG down the road, at a very low interest rate. You are basically saying to the bank "hey, how about you give me money now and I will give you back some of it in the future?" I say some of it, because if you do it right, you will make more income off the property than it cost you, in the long run.I'm saying unless you start with a lot of capital, RE is a very, very slow burn. As with most investments, more capital opens up more and varied opportunities with the chance of higher returns.
You can grow a lot of wealth, slowly, with RE..but don't try it without the wealth in the first place
You can grow a lot of wealth, slowly, with RE..but don't try it without the wealth in the first place
And you talk about the low ROI on investment properties, but you are not calculating it correctly. Let's say you make a 10% yearly return on a million dollar property. That is $100k a year. Let's say you put down 10% as a down payment for that property. That means you are actually making a 100% return every year on your actual investment, since you only invested $100k into a $1M property.
Not to mention that these days banks will accept an even lower down payment, I think the minimum is 3% or something crazy right now
01-12-2018, 10:53 PM
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#145
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Originally Posted By DrunkPanda18⏩
Which is all great in a rising market. Completely agree leverage is a wonderful thing, if used correctly. Because housing has always been seen as a relatively stable asset, they are easy to borrow large amounts against.What makes real estate an attractive investment is that you can put down just a fraction of the cost of a property upfront and start earning income off it right away once you get renters in, while not having to pay it back until LONG down the road, at a very low interest rate. You are basically saying to the bank "hey, how about you give me money now and I will give you back some of it in the future?" I say some of it, because if you do it right, you will make more income off the property than it cost you, in the long run.
And you talk about the low ROI on investment properties, but you are not calculating it correctly. Let's say you make a 10% yearly return on a million dollar property. That is $100k a year. Let's say you put down 10% as a down payment for that property. That means you are actually making a 100% return every year on your actual investment, since you only invested $100k into a $1M property.
Not to mention that these days banks will accept an even lower down payment, I think the minimum is 3% or something crazy right now
And you talk about the low ROI on investment properties, but you are not calculating it correctly. Let's say you make a 10% yearly return on a million dollar property. That is $100k a year. Let's say you put down 10% as a down payment for that property. That means you are actually making a 100% return every year on your actual investment, since you only invested $100k into a $1M property.
Not to mention that these days banks will accept an even lower down payment, I think the minimum is 3% or something crazy right now
The downside is inevitably that people start borrowing ever larger amounts on investment properties or their own houses, and at some point the smart money gets out. As values keep rising inflationary pressures build up and interest rates are forced up. The ordinary person is left high and dry as they can no longer cover the mortgage. When you are talking about such high value assets, it often gives them no choice but to declare bankruptcy.
01-12-2018, 11:23 PM
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#146
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Nothing really wrong with property. Its a relatively "safe" investment since the risk is low.
The biggest draw for property is the ability to leverage bank funds ( easier to obtain leverage on a house vs stocks if you take risk into concideration )
But yes, you are not retiring at under 50 off property unless your goals are small.
Risk = Reward, its always been like that and always will be.
Bitcoin(cryptos in general) could make you a millionaire in under a year if you go really aggressive and get very lucky. You could also go broke.
The biggest draw for property is the ability to leverage bank funds ( easier to obtain leverage on a house vs stocks if you take risk into concideration )
But yes, you are not retiring at under 50 off property unless your goals are small.
Risk = Reward, its always been like that and always will be.
Bitcoin(cryptos in general) could make you a millionaire in under a year if you go really aggressive and get very lucky. You could also go broke.
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01-13-2018, 06:37 AM
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#147
01-13-2018, 07:37 AM
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#148
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Originally Posted By vulgoo⏩
The hell is the matter with you?Property lol
01-13-2018, 08:08 AM
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#149
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Originally Posted By Mr-Nathan⏩
What companies did you invest in?op is right. property appreciation is small, yet everyone wants to do it. i think they see this as the easy route to residual income.
i have 2 portfolios, an ISA which is where my main investments go, and a CFD account which is for shorter term trades, usually on the companies i already own, which dip and i rebuy.
the CFD account is leveraged.
in the past year, my ISA is up 46% and my CFD account up 98%. Recently i've been asking myself the question, should i take all this money and buy a house? I currently rent in London. I am hesitant because i know that whatever house i buy will appreciate less than the investments i make, which are relatively safe, smaller companies.
also, anyone can learn to invest. i taught myself about the markets alongside my engineering degree (no formal financial education)
i have 2 portfolios, an ISA which is where my main investments go, and a CFD account which is for shorter term trades, usually on the companies i already own, which dip and i rebuy.
the CFD account is leveraged.
in the past year, my ISA is up 46% and my CFD account up 98%. Recently i've been asking myself the question, should i take all this money and buy a house? I currently rent in London. I am hesitant because i know that whatever house i buy will appreciate less than the investments i make, which are relatively safe, smaller companies.
also, anyone can learn to invest. i taught myself about the markets alongside my engineering degree (no formal financial education)
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