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BREAKING - Santa Fe School shooter - LIVE
05-18-2018, 10:46 PM
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#271
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Originally Posted By eod8989⏩
cliffs :Don't usually post in these threads but all these shooters look the same. They all look like they have never seen a vagina in their life and look FA. I'm sure there are plenty of other factors with these freaks but these are most likely the biggest factors.
Why don't people talk about the problem with incels and get them help? Is it because they are the extreme minority? Tired of it going unnoticed.
Why don't people talk about the problem with incels and get them help? Is it because they are the extreme minority? Tired of it going unnoticed.
if you arent destined for pu$$y you are destined to be a school shooter
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05-18-2018, 10:50 PM
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#272
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Misc, you hear about the school shooting in Georgia just then?
http://www.news.com.au/world/georgia...8f10219eb65553
Erryday is school-shooting day in USA now eh
http://www.news.com.au/world/georgia...8f10219eb65553
Erryday is school-shooting day in USA now eh
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05-18-2018, 11:21 PM
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#273
05-18-2018, 11:58 PM
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#274
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Originally Posted By ThisIsSceaming⏩
If you really believe that bazookas would be a big problem if they were legal, I'd like you to show me some examples. Look at cars, if you really want to wreck people, that's all you need to turn it into quite a delivery of mass destruction. Shooters are shooting guns because its more gratifying?Almost negged you for being too liberal. Our founding fathers are rolling in their graves at the fact that we can't purchase bazookas. How are we supposed to protect ourselves from the government's tanks if we can't have armor-piercing weaponry.
Take away guns, pointy things, and anything that could be used as a weapon and you still will have people making a precedent with some kind of new way of killing people.
So the inverse logic should be considered: why not simply trust your fellow adult with a weapon, because they already have plenty of means to kill you already.
derp.
"May the wrath of Zeus descend upon you like a great black toad in heat"
05-19-2018, 12:05 AM
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#275
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Originally Posted By Deathguard⏩
Because guns make it significantly easier to inflict lethal damage, at range, to a lot of people in a short amount of time.If you really believe that bazookas would be a big problem if they were legal, I'd like you to show me some examples. Look at cars, if you really want to wreck people, that's all you need to turn it into quite a delivery of mass destruction. Shooters are shooting guns because its more gratifying?
Take away guns, pointy things, and anything that could be used as a weapon and you still will have people making a precedent with some kind of new way of killing people.
So the inverse logic should be considered: why not simply trust your fellow adult with a weapon, because they already have plenty of means to kill you already.
derp.
Take away guns, pointy things, and anything that could be used as a weapon and you still will have people making a precedent with some kind of new way of killing people.
So the inverse logic should be considered: why not simply trust your fellow adult with a weapon, because they already have plenty of means to kill you already.
derp.
And because guns don't have a primary function (i.e., transportation) other than causing serious bodily harm.
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05-19-2018, 12:05 AM
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#276
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Originally Posted By dhawkeye1980⏩
Didn't London surpass NYC in violent crimes recently too?Ah yes the old europe is a eutopia cherry pick example
Just ignore the women who are afraid to go outside for being raped, the run away trucks killing people, or the fact that some of the most deadly shootings in history happened in europe. Wanna know what else guns in the US does that they dont do in europe? Save 100k+ lives every year.
Neat huh
Just ignore the women who are afraid to go outside for being raped, the run away trucks killing people, or the fact that some of the most deadly shootings in history happened in europe. Wanna know what else guns in the US does that they dont do in europe? Save 100k+ lives every year.
Neat huh
Yea, when people bring up gun violence, its a smoke and mirrors trick. Proper rebuttal when comparing crime rate is to clarify that violent crimes is more appropriate to analyze before going into that statistic, let alone the country's other factors like: what they classify as a violent crime, how restrictive they are, cultural plurality, freedom....
"May the wrath of Zeus descend upon you like a great black toad in heat"
05-19-2018, 12:08 AM
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#277
Originally Posted By Deathguard⏩
Nope! you can't say that!Didn't London surpass NYC in violent crimes recently too?
Yea, when people bring up gun violence, its a smoke and mirrors trick. Proper rebuttal when comparing crime rate is to clarify that violent crimes is more appropriate to analyze before going into that statistic, let alone the country's other factors like: what they classify as a violent crime, how restrictive they are, cultural plurality, freedom....
Yea, when people bring up gun violence, its a smoke and mirrors trick. Proper rebuttal when comparing crime rate is to clarify that violent crimes is more appropriate to analyze before going into that statistic, let alone the country's other factors like: what they classify as a violent crime, how restrictive they are, cultural plurality, freedom....
A town with 1000 knife murders per year is way much more better than a bigoted AMERICAN town with 50 shootings per year. wow gun crime is a disesese!!!!
B-b-but guns were made to kill people they are evil YOU CANT HAVE THEM!!!11one
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05-19-2018, 12:15 AM
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#278
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Originally Posted By jfcantu⏩
If there is a gathering of people in a gun free zone, this would be especially true. If people are armed, then this accepted risk-to-benefit of FREEDOM, would be reduced, since everyone ought to be armed anyway (cuz we dont live in paradise).Because guns make it significantly easier to inflict lethal damage, at range, to a lot of people in a short amount of time.
The weapon model for a society, that surely most rational people can agree upon, is that the agent of the government, being your standard infantryman (rifleman), his primary weapon, ought to be at least the standard mode of protection offered to the citizen, and anything deemed lower in standard (though guns are tools, but this incorporates shotguns, pistols etc).
The reasoning here is, it's consistent both with the spirit of the US constitution - the idea that laws ultimately are not a subject entirely to the state - because that is legitimizing tyranny essentially (thus diminishing a minority via might makes right).
The right to self preservation cannot rightly be reduced to just pointy things, army and police.
"May the wrath of Zeus descend upon you like a great black toad in heat"
05-19-2018, 12:18 AM
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#279
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Originally Posted By Deathguard⏩
Nothing you just said made sense.If there is a gathering of people in a gun free zone, this would be especially true. If people are armed, then this accepted risk to benefit of FREEDOM, would be reduced, since everyone ought to be armed anyway (cuz we dont live in paradise). However, just because you hit someone, does not mean they are going to die. Shot placement is paramount. It's not the movies.
The weapon model for a society, that surely most rational people can agree upon, is that the agent of the government, being your standard infantryman (rifleman), his primary weapon, ought to be at least the standard mode of protection offered to the citizen, and anything deemed lower in standard (though guns are tools, but this incorporates shotguns, pistols etc). The reasoning here is, it's consistent both with the spirit of the US constitution - the idea that laws ultimately are not a subject entirely to the state - because that is legitimizing tyranny essentially (thus diminishing a minority via might makes right).
The right to self preservation cannot rightly be reduced to just pointy things, army and police.
The weapon model for a society, that surely most rational people can agree upon, is that the agent of the government, being your standard infantryman (rifleman), his primary weapon, ought to be at least the standard mode of protection offered to the citizen, and anything deemed lower in standard (though guns are tools, but this incorporates shotguns, pistols etc). The reasoning here is, it's consistent both with the spirit of the US constitution - the idea that laws ultimately are not a subject entirely to the state - because that is legitimizing tyranny essentially (thus diminishing a minority via might makes right).
The right to self preservation cannot rightly be reduced to just pointy things, army and police.
USAF '09-'18. Master of Science. WoW player. Computer guy. Probably multitasking.
"That statement is either so deep it would take a lifetime to fully comprehend every particle of its meaning, or it is a load of absolute tosh. Which is it, I wonder?"
05-19-2018, 12:22 AM
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#280
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Originally Posted By jfcantu⏩
let me reduce it for you:Nothing you just said made sense.
If you like freedom, there's risk; it will always carry liability since freedom is not a guarantee that what you do is a wise or a safe route. So, if you want security, at the cost of your right of self preservation, your other freedoms are destined to go away.
So guns should allowed to protect the other freedoms/right we enjoy with the same power threshold a US rifleman has (at least their basic firearms).
On that topic, i personally think 'machine guns' should be allowed. People are tards about how 'scary' that weapon is.
"May the wrath of Zeus descend upon you like a great black toad in heat"
05-19-2018, 12:25 AM
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#281
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Originally Posted By jfcantu⏩
Weird that guns in the US are used more in self defense than to commit homicides...Because guns make it significantly easier to inflict lethal damage, at range, to a lot of people in a short amount of time.
And because guns don't have a primary function (i.e., transportation) other than causing serious bodily harm.
And because guns don't have a primary function (i.e., transportation) other than causing serious bodily harm.
Your argument doesnt have any merit to it. Firearms are our rights as citizens in the self preservation of life. It doesnt matter that criminals will use them to harm others, just like a knife used to kill someone doesnt invalidate their use or a vehicle by a drunk driver who kills someone.
We have a right as humans to self defense that includes using firearms
05-19-2018, 12:32 AM
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#282
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Originally Posted By Deathguard⏩
This is not an all-or-nothing scenario. We already impose reasonable restrictions on our various freedoms (e.g., you can't shout "fire" in a theater, you can't incite violence, you can't own a nuclear bomb, there are heavy restrictions on owning explosives and certain types of firearms.)If you like freedom, there's risk; it will always carry liability since freedom is not a guarantee that what you do is a wise or safe route. So, if you want security, at the cost of your right of self preservation, your freedom is practically gone.
I'm perfectly fine with people owning firearms for self-defense or for sporting. There are ways that we can, as a society, allow that while also maintaining restrictions that lessen the damage that someone can do in an attempted act of mass violence.
Problematically, special interest groups have convinced a large part of society that this IS an all-or-nothing scenario, and that any attempt at risk reduction/damage mitigation will inevitably result in a totalitarian worst-case scenario.
USAF '09-'18. Master of Science. WoW player. Computer guy. Probably multitasking.
"That statement is either so deep it would take a lifetime to fully comprehend every particle of its meaning, or it is a load of absolute tosh. Which is it, I wonder?"
05-19-2018, 12:36 AM
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#283
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Originally Posted By jfcantu⏩
Well when our founding fathers specifically stated "shall not be infringed" we kinda feel like that was importantThis is not an all-or-nothing scenario. We already impose reasonable restrictions on our various freedoms (e.g., you can't shout "fire" in a theater, you can't incite violence, you can't own a nuclear bomb, there are heavy restrictions on owning explosives and certain types of firearms.)
I'm perfectly fine with people owning firearms for self-defense or for sporting. There are ways that we can, as a society, allow that while also maintaining restrictions that lessen the damage that someone can do in an attempted act of mass violence.
Problematically, special interest groups have convinced a large part of society that this IS an all-or-nothing scenario, and that any attempt at risk reduction/damage mitigation will inevitably result in a totalitarian worst-case scenario.
I'm perfectly fine with people owning firearms for self-defense or for sporting. There are ways that we can, as a society, allow that while also maintaining restrictions that lessen the damage that someone can do in an attempted act of mass violence.
Problematically, special interest groups have convinced a large part of society that this IS an all-or-nothing scenario, and that any attempt at risk reduction/damage mitigation will inevitably result in a totalitarian worst-case scenario.
05-19-2018, 12:39 AM
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#284
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Originally Posted By dhawkeye1980⏩
Again, I'm perfectly okay with people owning firearms for self-defense.Firearms are our rights as citizens in the self preservation of life. It doesnt matter that criminals will use them to harm others, just like a knife used to kill someone doesnt invalidate their use or a vehicle by a drunk driver who kills someone.
We have a right as humans to self defense that includes using firearms
We have a right as humans to self defense that includes using firearms
I have a hard time with the idea that people desperately need an armory full of AR-15s with 100-round magazines and bump stocks for self-defense.
USAF '09-'18. Master of Science. WoW player. Computer guy. Probably multitasking.
"That statement is either so deep it would take a lifetime to fully comprehend every particle of its meaning, or it is a load of absolute tosh. Which is it, I wonder?"
05-19-2018, 12:41 AM
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#285
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Originally Posted By dhawkeye1980⏩
They also said "well-regulated militia."Well when our founding fathers specifically stated "shall not be infringed" we kinda feel like that was important
It's not a simple argument, one way or the other, which is why there's no shortage of judicial rulings on the subject.
USAF '09-'18. Master of Science. WoW player. Computer guy. Probably multitasking.
"That statement is either so deep it would take a lifetime to fully comprehend every particle of its meaning, or it is a load of absolute tosh. Which is it, I wonder?"
05-19-2018, 12:45 AM
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#286
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Originally Posted By jfcantu⏩
I have several AR15s and about 20k rounds of ammo...Again, I'm perfectly okay with people owning firearms for self-defense.
I have a hard time with the idea that people desperately need an armory full of AR-15s with 100-round magazines and bump stocks for self-defense.
I have a hard time with the idea that people desperately need an armory full of AR-15s with 100-round magazines and bump stocks for self-defense.
Why should i lose my rights because of a few lunatics and criminals?
My rights dont end so you can feel all warm and fuzzy
05-19-2018, 12:54 AM
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#287
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Originally Posted By dhawkeye1980⏩
Are you claiming that you have a right to self-defense, or that you have a right to own as many guns and as much ammunition as you want because you like them and you think they're cool?I have several AR15s and about 20k rounds of ammo...
Why should i lose my rights because of a few lunatics and criminals?
My rights dont end so you can feel all warm and fuzzy
Why should i lose my rights because of a few lunatics and criminals?
My rights dont end so you can feel all warm and fuzzy
If it's the first one, I'm curious about what plausible self-defense scenario has you needing a stockpile of AR's and ammunition.
If it's the second one - I think nuclear weapons are cool, but I'm not allowed to own one for fun (even though I wouldn't use it for evil) because there's no benefit and a whole lot of risk to society from allowing private citizens to own them. Obviously, firearms don't carry the same level of risk for society that nuclear weapons do, but it's pretty clear from current events that they create some level of heightened risk. From where I sit, it's a question of whether there's any benefit to society that comes from allowing individuals to own excessive amounts of firearms/ammunition, with no restrictions on firing capabilities, compared to the level of risk that it adds to society by allowing anyone to do that - and in my opinion, it's not.
USAF '09-'18. Master of Science. WoW player. Computer guy. Probably multitasking.
"That statement is either so deep it would take a lifetime to fully comprehend every particle of its meaning, or it is a load of absolute tosh. Which is it, I wonder?"
05-19-2018, 12:56 AM
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#288
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ITT:
- Circular logic
- Conversations that lead no where
- Live.laugh.love
- "Tyrannical government"
- "Muh freedom"
- Rinse and repeat
- Circular logic
- Conversations that lead no where
- Live.laugh.love
- "Tyrannical government"
- "Muh freedom"
- Rinse and repeat
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05-19-2018, 12:59 AM
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#289
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Originally Posted By jfcantu⏩
Both are my right as for self defenseAre you claiming that you have a right to self-defense, or that you have a right to own as many guns and as much ammunition as you want, because you like them and you think they're cool?
If it's the first one, I'm curious about what plausible self-defense scenario has you needing a stockpile of AR's and ammunition.
If it's the second one - I think nuclear weapons are cool, but I'm not allowed to own one for fun (even though I wouldn't use it for evil) because there's no benefit and a whole lot of risk to society from allowing private citizens to own them.
If it's the first one, I'm curious about what plausible self-defense scenario has you needing a stockpile of AR's and ammunition.
If it's the second one - I think nuclear weapons are cool, but I'm not allowed to own one for fun (even though I wouldn't use it for evil) because there's no benefit and a whole lot of risk to society from allowing private citizens to own them.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/m.mic.c...ed-their-lives
https://www.google.com/amp/s/bearing...koreatown/amp/
There are any number of self defense scenarios where an AR15 is effective.
05-19-2018, 01:00 AM
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#290
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Originally Posted By Ashfrolicious⏩
no uITT:
- Circular logic
- Conversations that lead no where
- Live.laugh.love
- "Tyrannical government"
- "Muh freedom"
- Rinse and repeat
- Circular logic
- Conversations that lead no where
- Live.laugh.love
- "Tyrannical government"
- "Muh freedom"
- Rinse and repeat
USAF '09-'18. Master of Science. WoW player. Computer guy. Probably multitasking.
"That statement is either so deep it would take a lifetime to fully comprehend every particle of its meaning, or it is a load of absolute tosh. Which is it, I wonder?"
05-19-2018, 01:05 AM
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#291
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Originally Posted By jfcantu⏩
I believe 'militia', incorporates the people as one and the same. fyi. There's the split between the organized and the unorganized too i believe.They also said "well-regulated militia."
It's not a simple argument, one way or the other, which is why there's no shortage of judicial rulings on the subject.
It's not a simple argument, one way or the other, which is why there's no shortage of judicial rulings on the subject.
"May the wrath of Zeus descend upon you like a great black toad in heat"
05-19-2018, 01:07 AM
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#292
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Originally Posted By dhawkeye1980⏩
Sure. But arguably, a handgun or shotgun is equally effective in most self defense situations.Both are my right as for self defense
https://www.google.com/amp/s/m.mic.c...ed-their-lives
https://www.google.com/amp/s/bearing...koreatown/amp/
There are any number of self defense scenarios where an AR15 is effective.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/m.mic.c...ed-their-lives
https://www.google.com/amp/s/bearing...koreatown/amp/
There are any number of self defense scenarios where an AR15 is effective.
USAF '09-'18. Master of Science. WoW player. Computer guy. Probably multitasking.
"That statement is either so deep it would take a lifetime to fully comprehend every particle of its meaning, or it is a load of absolute tosh. Which is it, I wonder?"
05-19-2018, 01:08 AM
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#293
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Originally Posted By Deathguard⏩
Right. But the point being, it's not as simple as reading the words at face value.I believe 'militia', incorporates the people as one and the same. fyi. There's the split between the organized and the unorganized too i believe.
USAF '09-'18. Master of Science. WoW player. Computer guy. Probably multitasking.
"That statement is either so deep it would take a lifetime to fully comprehend every particle of its meaning, or it is a load of absolute tosh. Which is it, I wonder?"
05-19-2018, 01:10 AM
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#294
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Originally Posted By jfcantu⏩
Not really when facing several armed assailants an AR15 is a superior weapon as was evident by the articles i posted. You dont use whats just "effective" when its life or death chief you use what gets the fukking job done.Sure. But arguably, a handgun or shotgun is equally effective in most self defense situations.
Also fyi as ive already stated banning AR15s wont stop it. Ar15s are benned in cali and that didnt stop the san bernadino shooters from illegally making one.
05-19-2018, 01:12 AM
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#295
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Originally Posted By jfcantu⏩
I have the right to life, liberty and my property. Among these things, a government must regulate certain things, but so much as to not remove any natural liberty for supposed civil liberty, that isn't truly warranted/required. This would be tyrannical if govt had this liberty.Are you claiming that you have a right to self-defense, or that you have a right to own as many guns and as much ammunition as you want because you like them and you think they're cool?
If it's the first one, I'm curious about what plausible self-defense scenario has you needing a stockpile of AR's and ammunition.
If it's the second one - I think nuclear weapons are cool, but I'm not allowed to own one for fun (even though I wouldn't use it for evil) because there's no benefit and a whole lot of risk to society from allowing private citizens to own them. Obviously, firearms don't carry the same level of risk for society that nuclear weapons do, but it's pretty clear from current events that they create some level of heightened risk. From where I sit, it's a question of whether there's any benefit to society that comes from allowing individuals to own excessive amounts of firearms/ammunition, with no restrictions on firing capabilities, compared to the level of risk that it adds to society by allowing anyone to do that - and in my opinion, it's not.
If it's the first one, I'm curious about what plausible self-defense scenario has you needing a stockpile of AR's and ammunition.
If it's the second one - I think nuclear weapons are cool, but I'm not allowed to own one for fun (even though I wouldn't use it for evil) because there's no benefit and a whole lot of risk to society from allowing private citizens to own them. Obviously, firearms don't carry the same level of risk for society that nuclear weapons do, but it's pretty clear from current events that they create some level of heightened risk. From where I sit, it's a question of whether there's any benefit to society that comes from allowing individuals to own excessive amounts of firearms/ammunition, with no restrictions on firing capabilities, compared to the level of risk that it adds to society by allowing anyone to do that - and in my opinion, it's not.
Obviously a case against ordinance could be made, as it goes beyond the purview of a citizen, but such regulation ought to be held closer to the bottom of the pyramid of power rather than inverted to the top (government should remain closer to the people not further).This would lean towards a states purview.
People have a propensity to make kings and disregard the represtation of our government, defaulting to national level rulings than what we are designed to do - as being a republic. States are to be an experiment, so that people vote with their feet as to where is the better place to live, even if this were to mean the danger of states being somewhat harmful (not entirely). That's their right and better since centralized power is more easily abused than one that decentralized. This also has limits. but i truly digress.
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05-19-2018, 01:15 AM
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#296
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Originally Posted By BlackJack619⏩
The statistics show that this happens in public schools more often. Thus, working 2 jobs to send kids to private schools.Does this ever happen in private schools?
Originally Posted By PerfectCelltech⏩
Exactly. There aren't the huge school shootings in Europe and Australia that we have in America. Yet America had the wild west background that those countries don't have. If you step outside of the big cities, they cling to their guns and Bibles in America.Aren't certain European countries doing the same thing? How come this doesn't happen over there as often?
Then a kid realizes he can get a gun/guns to give payback to the kids who bullied him and be in control.
Yes bullying is always there, but it's amplified to the nth degree on social media.
05-19-2018, 01:21 AM
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#297
- jfcantu
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Originally Posted By dhawkeye1980⏩
Yes, but from a risk mitigation standpoint, there's benefits to be had from allowing the ownership of weapons that are effective in self defense situations but less useful to an active shooter.Not really when facing several armed assailants an AR15 is a superior weapon as was evident by the articles i posted. You dont use whats just "effective" when its life or death chief you use what gets the fukking job done.
Also fyi as ive already stated banning AR15s wont stop it. Ar15s are benned in cali and that didnt stop the san bernadino shooters from illegally making one.
Also fyi as ive already stated banning AR15s wont stop it. Ar15s are benned in cali and that didnt stop the san bernadino shooters from illegally making one.
And also, yes, while anybody who's sufficiently determined can build a gun of any variety they want, there's a deterrent factor involved when you make it more difficult for people to get the tools they need to do bad stuff.
The argument that you're making is essentially that if we can't stop gun violence completely, we shouldn't even bother trying to do anything to lessen their frequency, or the damage that can be done when they do happen.
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05-19-2018, 01:28 AM
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#298
- bretmarathon
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Originally Posted By IH8RICE⏩
Exactly. Private schools won't tolerate bullying, but public schools just tell the parents sorry and sweep it under the rug. So basically only the rich are (somewhat) protected from bullying. It still exists in private schools, just like illegal drugs exist in private high schools. They just usually are the more expensive drugs.In his case it would be unwise. Students AND teachers were bullying him. Somehow he’s supposed to encounter all of them and punk them in front of everyone and walk away without being embarrassed or a bloody nose or worse? This isn’t phucking Kobra Kai. I’m not condoning what he did but it’s evident this kid saw no way but this way to solve his problem. I feel so bad for the families of the children and teacher who lost their lives over this nonsense. Before gun gontrol issues arise from this, we have to take a look at bullying. Every single private or charter school I’ve known has zero tolerance for stuff like that. I’ve seen kids expelled because of it and this was before it got to be a huge deal. The teachers should’ve been fired and the kids expelled or suspended because of it but no one said anything( neither did he I suppose). I think this generation of kids are beyond the old school bully-makes-me-a-stronger-person rhetoric most of us gen xers and prior tend to think about when stuff like this happens.
05-19-2018, 01:35 AM
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#299
- Prose Edda
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Not even surprised in all honesty, and what has changed? Nothing. See you guys in the next shooting post. Going by the rate of how frequently it occurs, 2-3 weeks.
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"In the darksome night of despair, my eye turneth expectant and full of hope to the morn of Thy boundless favor and at the hour of dawn my drooping soul is refreshed and strengthened in remembrance of Thy beauty and perfection." - `Abdu'l-Bahá
05-19-2018, 01:38 AM
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#300
Originally Posted By dhawkeye1980⏩
lol wut? Why are you making up bull****. A ****en army is never going to storm your house where you need an AR15 with all it’s tatical attachments to defend yourself. You have guns because you like them.Not really when facing several armed assailants an AR15 is a superior weapon as was evident by the articles i posted. You dont use whats just "effective" when its life or death chief you use what gets the fukking job done.
Also fyi as ive already stated banning AR15s wont stop it. Ar15s are benned in cali and that didnt stop the san bernadino shooters from illegally making one.
Also fyi as ive already stated banning AR15s wont stop it. Ar15s are benned in cali and that didnt stop the san bernadino shooters from illegally making one.
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