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Thread: You can only pick one martial art

post 1573040051 02-06-2019, 02:48 PM
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#211
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Originally Posted By BetaAsPhuck⏩
You didn't answer the questions.

Why isn't a knee to the head, a common tactic against takedowns?

Why don't you answer that question?

You presented a knee to the head as the hypothetical Muay Thai kid's defence against a wrestler's takedown... If it's that simple (you believe a Muay Thai kid will defeat a good high school wrestler), why don't elite strikers use it?
Because that **** doesnt work against wrestlers who are aware of what a striker can do and can respond to it, in other words, MMA fighters. A high school kid who doesnt train striking probably has less than 10 real fights in his life, most of them against kids who cant even throw a proper punch, let alone someone who can knee them to oblivion
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post 1573040161 02-06-2019, 02:50 PM
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#212
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Originally Posted By BetaAsPhuck⏩
Why did you post him as a response if it means nothing?

Cyborg is never known as a wrestler, and doesn't come from a wrestling background.

You posted that as some kind of response to a video with someone with an actual wrestling background, ploughing through a knee attempt to the head. So why?
I posted that as a response to what I think would happen between a kickboxer/MT fighter vs a wrestler who cant fight.
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post 1573040311 02-06-2019, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted By Azn00Superman⏩
Because that **** doesnt work against wrestlers who are aware of what a striker can do and can respond to it, in other words, MMA fighters.
You train Muay Thai.

Have you tried your knee to the head defence against pure wrestlers?
A high school kid who doesnt train striking probably has less than 10 real fights in his life, most of them against kids who cant even throw a proper punch, let alone someone who can knee them to oblivion
The Muay Thai guy won't have the timing or distancing to knee him in the head, because he's as inexperienced at the speed, timing and distancing of arealwrestling takedown as the wrestler is about actual Muay Thai striking.

You use the wrestler's inexperience of Muay Thai striking as a defence for why the knee to the head would work, but why do you dismiss the Muay Thai kid's inexperience of wrestling takedowns as a reason why it wouldn't work.

Just like a brawler =/= a Muay Thai fighter. A slopply tackle from an untrained person =/= a double leg takedown.

Muay Thai trained strikers (ie. K1 strikers) are well aware of how wrestler's takedown's work, they have experienced them over and over again in training and in matches. Yet that isn't their go to defence... Why?

That could tell you something about why the knee to the head wrestler takedown defence is not as good as you think it is. Unless you think you know better than the K1, Muay Thai, and Glory fighters who went into MMA.
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post 1573040371 02-06-2019, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted By Azn00Superman⏩
I posted that as a response to what I think would happen between a kickboxer/MT fighter vs a wrestler who cant fight.
Seeing as Cyborg is not a wrestling focused MMA fighter and doesn't come from a wrestling background, it's a poor example.
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post 1573040631 02-06-2019, 02:59 PM
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The idea of a "wrestler who can't fight" is an oxymoron.
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post 1573040861 02-06-2019, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted By BetaAsPhuck⏩
You train Muay Thai.

Have you tried your knee to the head defence against pure wrestlers?



The Muay Thai guy won't have the timing or distancing to knee him in the head, because he's as inexperienced at the speed, timing and distancing of arealwrestling takedown as the wrestler is about actual Muay Thai striking.

You use the wrestler's inexperience of Muay Thai striking as a defence for why the knee to the head would work, but why do you dismiss the Muay Thai kid's inexperience of wrestling takedowns as a reason why it wouldn't work.

Just like a brawler =/= a Muay Thai fighter. A slopply tackle from an untrained person =/= a double leg takedown.

Muay Thai trained strikers (ie. K1 strikers) are well aware of how wrestler's takedown's work, they have experienced them over and over again in training and in matches. Yet that isn't their go to defence... Why?

That could tell you something about why the knee to the head wrestler takedown defence is not as good as you think it is. Unless you think you know better than the K1, Muay Thai, and Glory fighters who went into MMA.
I'm speaking from my own perspective as a MT guy, ofc. Not dismissing a wrestler's ability to tackle, but I trust in the fact in Muay Thai a head dipped below chest level is an opening for knee, which is why you dont overdo head movements in Muay thai.

In the same vein, it's just like you have 0 faith at a MT fighter's ability to meet his knee to the wrestlers head, even though they practice and learn the timing of their own knees thousands of time. And that's doesnt even count the mental aspect of this fantasy fight. What if before the wrestler attempt a takedown, he receives a body kick so hard he had never felt before. Like the first time getting punched in the face, that shyt will shock anyone. An MMA fighter will shake it off or block the kick, then goes for the takedown, whereas the high school wrestler will think twice before engaging.
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post 1573040901 02-06-2019, 03:01 PM
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Sambo

It has both wresling and striking lul
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post 1573041041 02-06-2019, 03:03 PM
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Bjs
post 1573041171 02-06-2019, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted By Mr.PissShivers⏩
The idea of a "wrestler who can't fight" is an oxymoron.
Believe it or not there are wrestlers who cant fight. Wrestling isnt nearly as painful as fighting, it doesnt take a tough guy to do it, only one who can handle the conditioning. Which is why most high schools have wrestling programs and not boxing programs.
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post 1573041881 02-06-2019, 03:14 PM
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#220
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Originally Posted By Azn00Superman⏩
I'm speaking from my own perspective as a MT guy, ofc. Not dismissing a wrestler's ability to tackle, but I trust in the fact in Muay Thai a head dipped below chest level is an opening for knee,which is why you dont overdo head movements in Muay thai.
That would be a bad idea, because you can't go for a wrestling takedown.

There is a reason why K1, Muay Thai, and Glory fighters learn to sprawl.
In the same vein, it's just like you have 0 faith at a MT fighter's ability to meet his knee to the wrestlers head, even though they practice and learn the timing of their own knees thousands of time.
Not against wrestling takedowns, from wrestlers.
And that's doesnt even count the mental aspect of this fantasy fight. What if before the wrestler attempt a takedown, he receives a body kick so hard he had never felt before. Like the first time getting punched in the face, that shyt will shock anyone. An MMA fighter will shake it off or block the kick, then goes for the takedown, whereas the high school wrestler will think twice before engaging.
Wrestlers are notoriously tough, the training is gruelling.

A good high school wrestler, will have a high pain threshold and great conditioning.

Like I said... 9/10 the wrestler wins.

(Anyway, I've had fun arguing, no hard feelings.)
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post 1573041971 02-06-2019, 03:15 PM
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#221
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Originally Posted By Azn00Superman⏩
Believe it or not there are wrestlers who cant fight. Wrestling isnt nearly as painful as fighting, it doesnt take a tough guy to do it, only one who can handle the conditioning. Which is why most high schools have wrestling programs and not boxing programs.
Wrestling IS fighting, striking IS fighting. You can't deny certain elements of fighting to suit your argument.


BTW wrestling is absolutely brutal, to say otherwise is laughably out of touch.
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post 1573042031 02-06-2019, 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted By Azn00Superman⏩
Believe it or not there are wrestlers who cant fight. Wrestling isnt nearly as painful as fighting, it doesnt take a tough guy to do it, only one who can handle the conditioning.
If they can wrestle, they can fight.

Like he said: A wrestler who can't fight is an oxymoron.

If they can't wrestle, then they aren't a wrestler.
Which is why most high schools have wrestling programs and not boxing programs.
Probably also has more to do with head trauma from getting hit in the head leading to CTE (ie. brain damage), not your reasoning.

American Football leads to CTE, but people weren't aware of that until recently. People have known that being punched in the head is not good for the brain, for a long time.
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post 1573042061 02-06-2019, 03:17 PM
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post 1573042241 02-06-2019, 03:20 PM
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post 1573042561 02-06-2019, 03:25 PM
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I don’t know if any of you guys are history buffs, but there were these things called Gracie challenge matches and UFC 1, 2, 3 etc. and what happened is that the world learned (apparently not all of the world thou) that pure grapplers beat pure strikers, as well as pure grapplers beat the Ninja, dim mak, street fighting, special forces blah blah blah blah blah.
post 1573042691 02-06-2019, 03:27 PM
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#226
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Originally Posted By kusok⏩
I don’t know if any of you guys are history buffs, but there were these things called Gracie challenge matches and UFC 1, 2, 3 etc. and what happened is that the world learned (apparently not all of the world thou) that pure grapplers beat pure strikers, as well as pure grapplers beat the Ninja, dim mak, street fighting, special forces blah blah blah blah blah.
Its been happening way before that as well.
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post 1573042951 02-06-2019, 03:34 PM
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Wrestling is the most practical. IF an experienced wrestler can get to you and you don't know how to combat it, as in you're not a wrestler yourself, it's pretty much over.

Kinda the reason why wrestling is by far the most dominate aspect of MMA.
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post 1573045491 02-06-2019, 04:15 PM
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Originally Posted By kusok⏩
I don’t know if any of you guys are history buffs, but there were these things called Gracie challenge matches and UFC 1, 2, 3 etc. and what happened is that the world learned (apparently not all of the world thou) that pure grapplers beat pure strikers, as well as pure grapplers beat the Ninja, dim mak, street fighting, special forces blah blah blah blah blah.
Hahah this

Pure wrestlers will maul pure muay thai fighters in a street fight.

Muay thai doesnt teach how to stop a double, single leg takedown.
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post 1573046271 02-06-2019, 04:25 PM
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People who bring up guns are more retarded than BJJ practitioners.

When the jury finds out you killed an unarmed untrained 170lb college kid, you're going to jail for a very long time.

At least with BJJ you can teach them some proper manners and they gone on to be a better person. Besides, I doubt any of you are fast enough to draw in very close quarters
post 1573046531 02-06-2019, 04:30 PM
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Originally Posted By Manletbolic⏩
Hahah this

Pure wrestlers will maul pure muay thai fighters in a street fight.

Muay thai doesnt teach how to stop a double, single leg takedown.
Repped^^^

He speaks the truth.

I challenge any pure striker to walk into a D1 college wrestling practice room and pick a fight (full contact). The results will be very humbling for the striker.

Even Joe Rogan, who was a National Taekwondo Champion, says that wrestling is the best base for full contact fighting. He realized what a joke TaeKwondo was when he tried Kickboxing (most of the 'martial artsy' style moves were ineffective in a real striking scenario. He then realized how much more important wrestling was than kickboxing when he got into grappling. If you're a pure striker, as soon as you get taken down, you are a fish out of water. Most fights end up on the ground.
post 1573048821 02-06-2019, 05:15 PM
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Originally Posted By Manletbolic⏩
Hahah this

Pure wrestlers will maul pure muay thai fighters in a street fight.

Muay thai doesnt teach how to stop a double, single leg takedown.
Going down on the ground in a street fight is retarded though. I'm choosing mauy thai and Judo. Why would you wrestle somebody with strangers around you?

Wrestling and BJJ is only practical for competitive sports and defending yourself IF you go to the ground. Otherwise it's a complete waste of time
post 1573051011 02-06-2019, 05:51 PM
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#232
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Originally Posted By Train_Harder⏩
Repped^^^

He speaks the truth.

I challenge any pure striker to walk into a D1 college wrestling practice room and pick a fight (full contact). The results will be very humbling for the striker.
I challenging anyd1 wrestler to go to a legit Muay thai/kickboxing gym and pick a fight, the result will be very humbling for the wrestler.
Even Joe Rogan, who was a National Taekwondo Champion, says that wrestling is the best base for full contact fighting. He realized what a joke TaeKwondo was when he tried Kickboxing (most of the 'martial artsy' style moves were ineffective in a real striking scenario. He then realized how much more important wrestling was than kickboxing when he got into grappling. If you're a pure striker, as soon as you get taken down, you are a fish out of water. Most fights end up on the ground.
Taekwondo is shyt
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post 1573051411 02-06-2019, 05:57 PM
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Originally Posted By MikeLowrrrey⏩
Going down on the ground in a street fight is retarded though. I'm choosing mauy thai and Judo. Why would you wrestle somebody with strangers around you?

Wrestling and BJJ is only practical for competitive sports and defending yourself IF you go to the ground. Otherwise it's a complete waste of time
Judo is good, but wrestling is a waste of time?

I'm assume you're trolling, or you've never watched competitive wrestling or MMA?

(If you don't want to go to the ground with an opponent when executing a throw, just let go of them as they are falling. Only works with certain throws, of course.)



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUxfhIKQeFs



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bUNyYkMBWEs
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post 1573051431 02-06-2019, 05:58 PM
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Originally Posted By Azn00Superman⏩
I challenging anyd1 wrestler to go to a legit Muay thai/kickboxing gym and pick a fight, the result will be very humbling for the wrestler.



Taekwondo is shyt
I guess you missed early UFC and Gracie challenge matches. When there is no ref to separate the fighters once they clinch (and they always do many many times) it’s a different ballgame. If a MT guy has no takedown defense he is f*cked royally. It’s almost impossible to KO someone with your first strike who is good at timing and coming in for a quick single leg properly. This has all been tried before, we know what happens, it’s all on video.
post 1573051951 02-06-2019, 06:10 PM
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This chit is like paper scissor rocks, they all have weaknesses and strengths.. imo the perfect combo is wrestling and muay thai.. bjj is legit but the guard is very dangerous unless you're elite as fuk off your back, worst one in that list is judo which is highly ineffective without a gi or heavy street clothes
post 1573052591 02-06-2019, 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted By SwimToTheMoon⏩
This chit is like paper scissor rocks, they all have weaknesses and strengths.. imo the perfect combo is wrestling and muay thai.. bjj is legit but the guard is very dangerous unless you're elite as fuk off your back,worst one in that list is judo which is highly ineffective without a gi or heavy street clothes


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9odlO7y9Mg
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Bitcoin And 'The Elite' - Why Bitcoin Is Not Revolutionary
https://forum.obnoxiousbrutes.com/showthread.php?t=179820783
post 1573053031 02-06-2019, 06:31 PM
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Originally Posted By BetaAsPhuck⏩
Judo is good, but wrestling is a waste of time?

I'm assume you're trolling, or you've never watched competitive wrestling or MMA?

(If you don't want to go to the ground with an opponent when executing a throw, just let go of them as they are falling. Only works with certain throws, of course.)
I of course don't agree with what he was saying, but I would say for "street fighting"/self defense situations Judo overall has the better take downs.
Originally Posted By kusok⏩
I guess you missed early UFC and Gracie challenge matches. When there is no ref to separate the fighters once they clinch (and they always do many many times) it’s a different ballgame. If a MT guy has no takedown defense he is f*cked royally. It’s almost impossible to KO someone with your first strike who is good at timing and coming in for a quick single leg properly. This has all been tried before, we know what happens, it’s all on video.
He's obviously in denial and is just going to keep doubling down, just like the butthurt boxer a few pages back. It's crazy with all the evidence we have, and simple gravity being on a grapplers side that people still continue to be this delusional.
post 1573055761 02-06-2019, 07:11 PM
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Hey Silva was a striker and he won 16 fights in a row.
ℜ𝔢𝔦𝔫𝔥𝔞𝔯𝔡𝔱
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post 1573058861 02-06-2019, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted By MikeLowrrrey⏩
Going down on the ground in a street fight is retarded though. I'm choosing mauy thai and Judo. Why would you wrestle somebody with strangers around you?

Wrestling and BJJ is only practical for competitive sports and defending yourself IF you go to the ground. Otherwise it's a complete waste of time
lol what?

how is it retarded when you secure dominant position on top and make it completely one sided in your favor? A pure striker will not know how to get up when they are being mauled and at the same time cannot strike from the bottom when they aren't given any space too.
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post 1573060151 02-06-2019, 08:15 PM
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#240
  1. Manletbolic
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Originally Posted By kusok⏩
I guess you missed early UFC and Gracie challenge matches. When there is no ref to separate the fighters once they clinch (and they always do many many times) it’s a different ballgame. If a MT guy has no takedown defense he is f*cked royally. It’s almost impossible to KO someone with your first strike who is good at timing and coming in for a quick single leg properly. This has all been tried before, we know what happens, it’s all on video.
this is what suprises me, it's been proven time and time, a pure grappler will maul a pure striker, with regards to mixed, most cases a grappler with decent striking will maul a striker with decent grappling.

Grappling can dictate if the fight either stands up or go's to the ground.

You have someone like GSP one of the goat martial artist with zero highschool, collegiate wrestling background, who even had to change his game up and understand the importance of wrestling given in a fight that involves both striking and grappling.
The coming of the Manlet saviour

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