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Forum » Vaccine-cels called me out for using this logic to not get it RIGHT NOW [srs wincel]
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Thread: Vaccine-cels called me out for using this logic to not get it RIGHT NOW [srs wincel]

post 1642880753 07-15-2021, 12:22 AM
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Originally Posted By insidemane⏩
Strong mid section/waist to arm size ratio

And who was delts?

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post 1642881063 07-15-2021, 12:31 AM
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Originally Posted By atgbrahsrs⏩
Science progresses and I hope it does. I just do not want to necessarily be part of the discovery process.

Different drug, same principle. A lot of research on AZ safety is done with previous viral-vector vaccine reserach. But they are technically different drugs, targeting different mechanisms. So are you telling me I can't trust that either :?


1) I am not sure why someone who is just chilling not rushing anything should rush anything due to random people doing internet acts of trolling on the internet spaces


2) People who cannot discriminate between accurate, reliable data (EU Medicines Agency Astra-Zeneca safety data and Public Health England Covid-19 infection/hospitalisation rate) versus flawed and misleading data (Discredited physician Andrew Wakefield study on MMR vaccines causing autism) are responsible for their own fates


3) Which is estimated to be most people over 30 for solid herd immunity. Which means it is all circumstantial.
No. I'm telling you to look at the science on how the mRNA vaccine is metabolized.

And to reach the desired levels for herd immunity, we'd need much higher vaccination rates. As of right now, due to people like you, we will never reach herd immunity. This implies covid will be a prolonged problem until you people stop living in denial.

If you infect an immunocompromised person, such as a child with an organ donation or an elderly woman, then their blood is on your hands. You knew better.
post 1642881163 07-15-2021, 12:33 AM
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Originally Posted By wincel⏩
Use some brainpower to determine the risk of clotting from covid and compare that to the risk of clotting from each of the vaccines. Compare the risk of death from covid to that of each of the vaccines. Then, you will unambiguously see that taking the vaccine is the rational choice.
So, to quote from the one with the most Covid-19 patients -https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1....27.21256153v1
Cerebral venous thrombosis and portal vein thrombosis: a retrospective cohort study of 537,913 COVID-19 cases


What is known

‐ A systematic review of cohort studies suggested an incidence of CVT among hospitalised patients with COVID-19 to be about 800 per million patients. There was evidence of selection, ascertainment, and reporting bias in all included studies.

‐ The incidence of CVT and PVT among both hospitalised and non-hospitalised patients with COVID-19 is unknown.

‐ It is unknown if COVID-19 increases the risk of CVT and PVT.

What this study adds Our study estimates that the absolute risk of CVT and PVT are respectively 42.8 and 392.3 per million patients (both hospitalised and non-hospitalised) in the 2 weeks after a diagnosis of COVID-19. COVID-19 increases the risk of CVT and PVT compared to patients diagnosed with influenza, and to people who have received a COVID-19 mRNA vaccine.
43 per 1 million = 0.0043% whilst not adjusted for my age cohort, which greatly reduces the blood clot from AZ if I am completely cherry-pick free


top it off at a 0.064% infection rate because to get blood-clotting from covid-19 one must be infected with covid, which is a separate event




but you know what, let's indulge and talk prevention:

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post 1642881323 07-15-2021, 12:38 AM
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I mean yeah, for shut-ins with 0 contact with society, like OP, it makes no difference if they are vaxxed or no.
post 1642881443 07-15-2021, 12:43 AM
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Originally Posted By atgbrahsrs⏩
So, to quote from the one with the most Covid-19 patients -https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1....27.21256153v1





43 per 1 million = 0.0043% whilst not adjusted for my age cohort, which greatly reduces the blood clot from AZ if I am completely cherry-pick free


top it off at a 0.064% infection rate because to get blood-clotting from covid-19 one must be infected with covid, which is a separate event




but you know what, let's indulge and talk prevention:

What's the baseline rate of CVT and PVT?
post 1642881503 07-15-2021, 12:45 AM
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Originally Posted By Anachron⏩
Why aren't they vaccinated?
Many of them are. Some people who are immunocompromised lose antibodies and have a hard time making new ones, which is why the doctors are looking into a third booster shot for some patients.

Also, in a Red state where most of the population is aggressively antivaxxer, many of these people are also not being vaccinated. The result is going to be that irresponsible people will get them sick and kill them. It could have all been avoided.
post 1642881523 07-15-2021, 12:46 AM
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Originally Posted By Chris_1990⏩
I mean yeah, for shut-ins with 0 contact with society, like OP, it makes no difference if they are vaxxed or no.
In all fairness it makes no difference for anybody if you're vaxxxed or not because IT works, Right....?!
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post 1642881743 07-15-2021, 12:54 AM
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Originally Posted By wincel⏩
What's the baseline rate of CVT and PVT?
If we consider EU medicine agency data on Astra Zeneca and this paper accurate, why would it matter what is the baseline of CVT when it does not vary significantly between AZ side effects and Covid-19 related?


And if we actually assume an infection event has OCCURRED (which is probably lower than 0.64% for my age group) and we adjust Covid-19 blood-clot data for my age group... I hope we don't find a statistical event where getting Covid-19 reduces baseline blood-clot risk (...as if covid super sick people happen to be those fat, metabolically unhealthy ones with health problems before covid ???)

Then... you might have to admit that immature data is hard to draw conclusions from...

I recommend you don't go there since you don't want Anachron to have a field day.
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post 1642881763 07-15-2021, 12:55 AM
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Originally Posted By atgbrahsrs⏩
If we consider EU medicine agency data on Astra Zeneca and this paper accurate, why would it matter what is the baseline of CVT when it does not vary significantly between AZ side effects and Covid-19 related?


And if we actually assume an infection event has OCCURRED (which is probably lower than 0.64% for my age group) and we adjust Covid-19 blood-clot data for my age group... I hope we don't find a statistical event where getting Covid-19 reduces baseline blood-clot risk (...as if covid super sick people happen to be those fat, metabolically unhealthy ones with health problems before covid ???)

Then... you might have to admit that immature data is hard to draw conclusions from...

I recommend you don't go there since you don't want Anachron to have a field day with you.
Because the paper pointed out some of the absolute risks. I want to see how they compare to baseline.
post 1642881903 07-15-2021, 12:59 AM
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Originally Posted By Anachron⏩
So if an antivaxxer gets sick and is "killed", why would the onus be on OP, and not the antivaxxer?
If the OP is also unvaccinated, both are to blame, but the young are especially stubborn to not get vaccinated. Many age 30 or so are only thinking of their own personal safety and incentives and not about the population as a whole.
post 1642881923 07-15-2021, 01:00 AM
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Originally Posted By wincel⏩
NM I think that was old data that I saw. The AZ vaccine is showing at what you said.

One thing is you're comparing death/hospital rate of covid to clot rate of vaccine. What about clot rate of covid?

And again you also need to consider the benefit you are providing to the vulnerable by vaccinating.

Personally, I wouldn't take AZ. I'd take one of the other ones. AZ has seemed to be the worst. It isn't approved in the US even for emergency use. It's cheap to make though.
Why would I potentially harm my body to protect some vulnerable rando...?

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post 1642881953 07-15-2021, 01:01 AM
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Originally Posted By wincel⏩
Because the paper pointed out some of the absolute risks. I want to see how they compare to baseline.
Which will help your argument in what way?
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post 1642881973 07-15-2021, 01:02 AM
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Originally Posted By smashedurgfx10⏩
Why would I potentially harm my body to protect some vulnerable rando...?

Definition of cuckoldry lmao
Would you eat a peanut to save a kid with an organ donation?
post 1642881983 07-15-2021, 01:03 AM
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Originally Posted By atgbrahsrs⏩
Which will help your argument in what way?
There was no argument being made. I asked you to compare the risks. I was just wondering if you had seen what the baseline risk was and if you took that into account to see how much riskier the vaccine is than baseline.
post 1642882063 07-15-2021, 01:06 AM
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Originally Posted By wincel⏩
There was no argument being made. I asked you to compare the risks. I was just wondering if you had seen what the baseline risk was and if you took that into account to see how much riskier the vaccine is than baseline.
If the risk of the vaccine is greater or equal to that of Covid-19 (which depends on getting infected at a very low infection rate and me being generous using data for all age groups) why would I need to consider this?

If the baseline risk is X and you do the proportions the vaccine will come out equal or more again.....
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post 1642882073 07-15-2021, 01:06 AM
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Originally Posted By Anachron⏩
Interesting how you changed your mind after I called you out on it.

Care to link me to the study which shows me that vaccinated people have 0% chance of transmitting the virus?
You're doing that thing you do where you fabricate/straw man a claim and then demand evidence for it.

Why do you molest kids? Care to link me evidence showing you don't molest kids?
post 1642882093 07-15-2021, 01:08 AM
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Originally Posted By atgbrahsrs⏩
If the risk of the vaccine is greater or equal to that of Covid-19 (which depends on getting infected at a very low infection rate and me being generous using data for all age groups) why would I need to consider this?

If the baseline risk is X and you do the proportions the vaccine will come out equal or more again.....
I don't think you get this. I'm not being political or arguing. I'm literally asking do you know and can you share? If not, then nevermind. I'm wanting to see what the baseline rate is to compare it to that for the AZ vaccine.
post 1642882153 07-15-2021, 01:11 AM
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Those Chinese broads from rite aid were hot for sure. I’d Fucj with them no doubt on that. Problem of course is can’t really do anything with China until this Covid situation is resolved. Still those broads rite aid were cool.. sorry id got cross over there a moment due to the whole situation with Chinese people from big tech and the dems thinking they’d been able to dictate my constitutional rights based off some dumb ****... anyways. Yeah I’d love tj smash those broads. Too bad it would be of little benefit to China until they’re all done that whole situations with ugh you know? Covid
post 1642882223 07-15-2021, 01:13 AM
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Yo I was like? Man I wish I would have went home with those ladies but of course? I was research chemicals and **** so it was no dice. Which of course is exactly what the dems wanted. Not that I blame the females but it’ll be so glorious to make them all pay dearly
post 1642882263 07-15-2021, 01:14 AM
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Originally Posted By Anachron⏩
Exhibit A of what happens when you make a pseudo intellectual run out of googled material.

Explain how asking for a study that proves vaccinated people have 0% chance of transmitting the virus is strawman.

It's very simple, there isn't one.

And the onus of a claim of someone molesting kids, would be on the person making the claim. So please show me evidence that I do.

And that is the third apology you owe me.
Right. You asked for evidence of a claim I never made. You introduced it and then demanded evidence for it and presented it like some gotcha. Nobody here said the vaccine leads to 0% chance of transmitting. You were the first to make that claim.

Vaccines substantially reduce your chance of transmitting the virus.
post 1642882313 07-15-2021, 01:15 AM
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Originally Posted By wincel⏩
You're doing that thing you do where you fabricate/straw man a claim and then demand evidence for it.

Why do you molest kids? Care to link me evidence showing you don't molest kids?
yikes, the burden of proof?
Originally Posted By wincel⏩
I don't think you get this. I'm not being political or arguing. I'm literally asking do you know and can you share? If not, then nevermind. I'm wanting to see what the baseline rate is to compare it to that for the AZ vaccine.
I literally cant find one not being fogged by Covid-19 and vaccines.

And I think you don't get this - you made several claims ITT that taking the vaccine is the rational choice. Despite, plenty of contextual data showing it is not that black-or-white.
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post 1642882413 07-15-2021, 01:18 AM
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Originally Posted By atgbrahsrs⏩
yikes, the burden of proof?



I literally cant find one not being fogged by Covid-19 and vaccines.

And I think you don't get this - you made several claims ITT that taking the vaccine is the rational choice. Despite, plenty of contextual data showing it is not that black-or-white.
It is literally black and white. The paper you linked indicates the risk of clotting is higher with covid than the vaccines. The data you linked suggested the vaccines are a better choice than the virus or no vaccine.
post 1642882473 07-15-2021, 01:20 AM
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Originally Posted By Anachron⏩
Ok, let's try this again.

Unvaccinated person gets another person sick, according to you is the fault of the unvaccinated person.

Vaccinated person gets another person sick?



Waiting on that apology btw. You really need to stop running your mouth.
According to me, voluntarily being unvaccinated substantially increased the spread and was negligent behavior. Both are at fault for this if both are unvaccinated.

If a vaccinated person gets someone sick, at least they took measures recommended to try to be safe.

I can't believe you can't understand this.

You're literally making chit up and making a retarded argument. Shooting at someone also doesn't guarantee they die. We still hold them accountable for their action. Ditto for someone who negligently packs and sells meat contaminated with bacteria.
post 1642882553 07-15-2021, 01:23 AM
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Originally Posted By Anachron⏩
And getting the vaccine is the only measure that you can take?
It's literally the best and most highly recommended one by medical professionals. Failing to take a vaccine promotes the spread of this disease, and if you get someone else sick, imo you are to blame. Anyway it's an opinion. You can't prove it wrong. You also made up some bs you thought I said, which I didn't. Nice distraction.

Anyway, here are the facts. The vaccines are far less risky than the virus. This is not debated by anyone. The science has shown this.
post 1642882713 07-15-2021, 01:28 AM
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Originally Posted By Anachron⏩
Please re-read the question.
I read it and answered it.

We aren't doing this game again. Your dishonest attempt at putting words in my mouth doesn't give you control. It makes you look like an idiot.
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Originally Posted By wincel⏩
It's literally the best and most highly recommended one by medical professionals. Failing to take a vaccine promotes the spread of this disease, and if you get someone else sick, imo you are to blame. Anyway it's an opinion. You can't prove it wrong. You also made up some bs you thought I said, which I didn't. Nice distraction.

Anyway, here are the facts. The vaccines are far less risky than the virus. This is not debated by anyone. The science has shown this.
adjusted to my age group they are not as Covid-19 infection rates and especially symptom severity is linked to increasing age and pre-existing conditions
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post 1642882873 07-15-2021, 01:37 AM
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Originally Posted By atgbrahsrs⏩
adjusted to my age group they are not as Covid-19 infection rates and especially symptom severity is linked to increasing age and pre-existing conditions
The AZ vaccine is of lower risk to you than covid. You have not analyzed the statistics correctly. For starters, you assume every adverse event report is causally linked to the vaccine. Next, you yourself linked a paper showing the virus was far more likely to cause blod clot issues than the vaccine was. You also linked a graphic that argued that the benefit outweighed the cost even when we don't know the direct causal link. So how are you rationally concluding it is better to remain unvaccinated? You also seem to think your risk of infection is extremely low. It isn't. Over the course of the next year, if you live in a community where many are unvaccinated and don't take safety measures, your risk of exposure is high.
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Originally Posted By Anachron⏩
You need to stop editing every single one of your posts, I am not going to scroll through every thread looking to see if you edited it.

Here's the question again :

Is it theonlymeasure you can take?

I bolded the key part to help your poor reading comprehension skills. The answer is yes or no. Stop being intellectually dishonest.
It's literally the best and most highly recommended one by medical professionals. Failing to take a vaccine promotes the spread of this disease, and if you get someone else sick, imo you are to blame. Anyway it's an opinion. You can't prove it wrong. You also made up some bs you thought I said, which I didn't. Nice distraction.

Anyway, here are the facts. The vaccines are far less risky than the virus. This is not debated by anyone. The science has shown this.
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Originally Posted By wincel⏩
The AZ vaccine is of lower risk to you than covid. You have not analyzed the statistics correctly. For starters, you assume every adverse event report is causally linked to the vaccine. Next, you yourself linked a paper showing the virus was far more likely to cause blod clot issues than the vaccine was. You also linked a graphic that argued that the benefit outweighed the cost even when we don't know the direct causal link. So how are you rationally concluding it is better to remain unvaccinated? You also seem to think your risk of infection is extremely low. It isn't. Over the course of the next year, if you live in a community where many are unvaccinated and don't take safety measures, your risk of exposure is high.
So the link vaccine-blood clot is a correlation but the virus-blood clot one is causation - I see.

I don't think my infection rate is low - I literally read it from Public Health England, which controls the National Health Service of England and manages all data in relation to that. I think that is the one most relevant to me given that I live in England?

Unfortunately, they have not broken it down into age groups and I am using the aggregate 0.64% figure in July 2021.
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post 1642883083 07-15-2021, 01:45 AM
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Originally Posted By Anachron⏩
Here's the question again :

Is it the only measure you can take?

I bolded the key part to help your poor reading comprehension skills. The answer is yes or no. Stop being intellectually dishonest.
Here's the thing you don't get. It doesn't matter if it's the only one. You're trying to do some gotcha bullchit where you argue you aren't culpable because you took other measures. Guess what retard? The medical community recommends the vaccines. Not taking their recommendation means you have chosen to put your superstition over science. You have negligently put yourself and others at risk. It doesn't need to be the only measure. That's entirely irrelevant. There are other measures you could take, such as suicide. But that is not recommended by medical professionals. There are also other measures people around you could take such as homicide, but that isn't recommended by medical professionals. What is recommended is that you go take the vaccine offered to you. Failing to do that puts you and others at risk. Glad I clarified that for you.
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