Some do, but in 99% of cases, I would argue they do not.

We are way too quick to cut, inject, and throw pain killers at people.

Traditional pt is broken which doesn't help matters.

The system is completely ass backwards focused on symptoms and insurance and consequently filled with confusion, frustration, and uncertainty.

It needs to be competely redesigned and focus on root cause.

PT system is fine as long as you get with PT who work with athletes. I would be a jaded zombie PT too if all my clients skipped appointments, we’re fat as fuk, never did their exercises etc.. which has to be atleast 80% of the people they see.

I will respectfully disagree about that 99%.

While I will absolutely agree that we definitely are way too quick to do all of that, a lot of situations necessitate it. You were lucky enough that you didn't. There are people that can handle pain, and there are exponentially more that can't. It becomes much worse when those that can't also struggle with patience and can't take time off to fully heal, further complicating things.

System definitely is ass backwards. FFS, we have people going to doctors and telling them what they want to take because they've seen commercials on TV. Sadly, that'll won't change in our lifetimes.

I'm all for good, physical therapy and whatnot first. I think surgery and drugs first are a terrible first option, but I highly doubt OP hasn't tried a ton of different things already.

Pain is a mother****er.

I don't know, this stuff is crazy.

Thanks for ur insight on this stuff.

So, in regards to that reversed cervical spine thingy. I'm kind of confused. Initially I thought I should train my deep cervical flexors, mainly because their attachments favor a standard lordotic curve when strong. (Longus capitus/colli) But when the curve is backwards, what does that mean? I can't visualize it, but would I increase the cervical kyphosis by doing these exercises? Sounds bad. (I feel as if the local muscles influence spine health/positioning a lot, practitioners never mention this, they always jump to surgery and drugs. Or even worse, say you're faking lol.)

I guess I could lay on a brick or something to force a lordotic curve, try to stay like that and perhaps try to train deep cervical flexors? No idea, sounds risky.

Thanks, so, is that just a way of saying keep perfect posture? Like, tuck chin, roll back shoulders, subtle posteriorly tilt, force foot arch etc. I guess that'll stabilise my spine.

Could this not be fixed in a week if this is the case? Forcing posture doesn't seem like an adaptation that'll take years. Most fix it relatively quickly if they're not little girls wincing at the first feeling of discomfort.



So who shall I go to, specialist wise? Private health sounds cool, but is it a waste in this case?

Should I be concerned about all of this? Like, will I be a cripple later on, or even paralysed?

Thanks.

Did your at least get decent lats with your routine?

My spine is pretty messed up. I'm worried that something much worse will happen later on. I have to use a walking stick/keep hands in my pockets, like a sling. I try to walk backwards to get adequate hip extension, stopping lumbar extension and forcing a neutral pelvic tilt. Lol, this stuff is absurd.

I don't know what to do at this point. I'm waiting on the referrals. I am trying physio again. Both my shoulders are destroyed, so I have to do a lot of isometrics.

If you're going to keep lifting. I'd recommend to stop lifts that compress the spine like squats and deadlifts. (Ded fkn Srs)

Problem is this has been put into place with regular force production at high loads over and over again. That's how small shifts happen over time and your body's structure (ie skeleton and joints) will be influenced by the force placed on it and adapt to that. So you've applied enough force over a period of years to reverse the curve of one of your spinal areas. That type of thing doesn't get corrected in a short period of time.

I'd say off the top of my head take the first year and focus on spinal alignment, the goal of which being pain reduction and increasing active ROM of things like neck flexion/extension, lumbar and pelvic movement and isometric strength in the right positions. Major goal would be to minimize nerve compression to reduce pain and then increase the ability to generate force in the right movement plane. It's a long road, but it can be done. Only thing that you can do is try and get started, there's no point in ignoring it any further.

As another poster said, I'd go for a sports PT or AT who really, really knows their stuff and recognizes the loads you've placed on your body through working out. Regular physios mostly don't have a clue when it comes to anything beyond rotator cuff tendonitis or minor muscle injuries.

Dude I told you what to do. It's not that complicated to realign a misaligned spine. Read the ****ing book (pain free by pete egoscue - 1st edition) or LDAR like most people. I'm out.

Orthopaedic physio? I dont think so, I just went to a regular physio, does that matter? I have been referred to an orthopaedic surgeon. To discuss surgery options.

That's the thing, I didn't have any accident. No whiplash or crash. Just randomly started, load of crap I swear.

Hmmm I'm not sure about pain medicine. I have tried a ton a few years ago, (only because the doctor advised it), it didn't work. I remember being on a giant dose of amitriptyline, nefopam, and so many others.

Is there an ultra strong pain killer out there? One where if I rip my arm off, I won't feel pain? I honestly couldn't give a **** about my spine, I just hate the 24/7 horrific pains I'm having.

I remember someone in an old thread mentioned opioids? Apparantly I shouldn't take it because it's addicting, but who cares. Do you recommend it? I don't even know where to buy it, not even sure if they have it in UK lol.


Yeah, I have fish oil everyday. Lol, I'll hop on deca, finally get a ripped spine, thanks.

I don't know if I should move my lower back with all that degeneration going on. Same with swimming/any cardio. Let's say swimming, each stroke pulls with a hypertonic pec minor/bicep, upper arm medially rotates thus lengthening the scapular adductors (mid/lower trap and rhomboids) which will further destroy my posture. Similar with walking/cycling/anything. Best case scenario, I sit, and.....sit? Lol, crazy.

What do I think? Best form of exercise might be to walk in the pool.

Thanks.

No accident or anything. I'm not qualified in this, but I feel as if dysfunctional muscles have done this, but I don't know.

Haha :/

I've never heard of that. Why do u recommend it? Do u take it?

I have heard of people using those drugs to help, sounds shady though.

I shy away from drugs because it just submerges pain, the destructive force is still there. But I don't know, I may try drugs, someone mentioned opioids before. What do u think?

Why does ur hip hurt? Did you try getting to the root cause? Or did you just end up with trying to suppress the pains?

Yeah, a surgeon is on the refferal list.

Also, what is that picture in your avatar? I've seen that for years.

The thing is I have read it. Another person on bb.com recommended it at the beggining stages of my pains (made these threads over a long time), along with a trigger point therapy work book by Clair Davies.

I will take another read. Thanks.

Why do u think fixing spine misalignment isn't so hard? Sure, if it's just 1 region, but when it's all 3 of them it's a disaster.

You say you bounced back, but I doubt you can lift heavy. (Max out). Plus, even though your lumbar spine is feeling better, I'm sure there are local muscle compensation patterns present to adapt to that disc bulge. Ineffective motor recruitment patterns and 1 wrong move puts you in hospital? I'm not sure, correct if wrong.


I saw ur other message, that was in response to someone else. Just explaining the story and what I've done so far.

op needs cervicle fusion luckily they have a lot better outcomes than lumbar fusions

edit.. just read the first part and then read the rest. OP what kind of crazy chit have you been doing? Trying to suk your dink, snap city deadlifts, high falls and gymnastics?

Lol :0

kinda looks like mine imo. seems like you have a bad lower but mine extended a little higher. it also crept up to my neck.

mine only hurts when i stand on concrete forever. but i even remember back when i worked at a grocery store i got used to that

as for working out, i stop any time something hurts it

Yes! They are giant, I wish I could atrophy them somehow. The thing is, that 85kg chip was a 2rm. I attached 100kg and I swear I tore my pec minor lol, just at the dead hang too.

Well BPC-157 is a site-specific peptide meant to heal/repair damaged nerves and TB-500 is a systemic wound healing peptide.

No I haven't taken it but it's pretty popular among bodybuilders/athletes in general.

Makes sense, sucks that it works like this.

Funnily enough, I probably had the most spinal decompression ever. Constantly dangling 50kg+ around my ass haha.


So, have u ever dealt with chronic pains?

I have Spinal spondylosis

Get used to pain

Nothing works, stretching, heat ,inversion, nothing

It's arthritis in your spine

Ah I see, thanks for explaining that. I am right in saying that this is a muscular issue? (Nobody can push the spinal column at will)

****kkkk, these time frame are crazy. My ROM is perfect. I don't like physios/specialists. I find they are very incompetent. E.g, a postural deviation like rounded shoulders. As your shoulders are inwardly rotated, you will have a reduced inward rotation of the shoulder. Since the shoulder is always in a 'rolled forward position', it doesn't actually need to rotate as much to get your arm out infront of you and because of this, you will have lost range of motion in your shoulder. A placebo of a large range of external rotation in the shoulder, something specialists diagnose as hypermobility! Getting me to do unnessesary shoulder capsule stretches that'll cause damage! Terrible damage since the shoulder capsule is already under a ton of stress!

Little things like that really bug me, just that small error would change my diagnosis and path to recovery, possibly even **** me up.
So how can I avoid a situation like that? In that scenario I corrected the specialist, they apologized, whatever. But what if they make a mistake on something that's completely out of my knowledge zone?

So what about that thought process on fixing cervical kyphosis by strengthening the deep cervical flexors? I don't get it.

Thanks.

I always tell clients - muscles don't really do anything except push and pull across a joint surface. And they respond to load and force (and what your brain tells them to do). So in the example you cited above (inward or anterior shoulder rotation) typically you've spent too much time in that position, therefore one set of muscles has been trained to not work much - so the opposing muscles are working constantly to try to bring them back into balance. It's a constant tug of war and the problem people run into is they have one side that pulls too much and another that either doesn't pull (because of position) or can't pull (because of weakness) - or both. I find in my practice that most often people need to strengthen more and "stretch" far less, but then most people have a completely wrong view of what those two words actually mean. Including most PTs.

Muscles are tight for a reason, and usually that is because your body wants to be "straight" - meaning balanced in all planes. Once your structure changes (like yours has) the muscles adapt to a new position constantly. Then the joints aren't able to hold on and get compromised. Most people need to stop thinking muscle and start thinking joint, and therefore what's going on with all the muscles that cross that joint and what they are trying to do.

Simplest way I can explain it is imagine if you reversed the forces you've been subjecting your body to for years and only did those exercises. How would that affect your muscles and skeleton? I wouldn't suggest that BTW because your body is fully developed now and in a different state, but you get the idea.

So unfortunately no, it's not a muscular issue at all. It's structural. Can you change that path? Probably because yes, you can adjust the lines of force through your skeleton and stimulate it to move - it just takes a long time to do so.

I saw that on TV, most the time ur crippled anyways with that.

Lol, been doing progressive overload on spine day. Fed spine with stem cells/creatine, rewarded me with stability, or is it instability? Wooo!!

Me mentioning that inward rotation thing was me saying that practitioners misdiagnose stuff with confidence. They prescribed something that would **** me up. I need to know how to spot that with stuff I don't understand. Is there a qualification a specialist could have that makes them a genius? (Something to look out for when choosing a specialist)

Yeah I get that concept about the rounded shoulders thingy.

Thanks for explaining that next part about the skeleton stuff. Interesting stuff! I just thought muscles would greatly influence joints/structures since they are very powerful?

Also, when u said that my body is now fully developed, could this be a permanent thing? Ie, have I grown into this dysfunction? (Usually people pick up dysfunctions when they're a lot older and can undo the damage on the same frame they had prior to their injury/whatever.

So, have you ever seen a case like mine? If you have, what exactly did they do? Maybe I can cross-reference their recovery and apply it to me.


Thanks.

Nope. Like another poster said, I've seen my share of MRIs and that's only the second time I've ever seen the word reversal. I've dealt with some pretty gnarly cases over the years when it comes to spines and all I can say is this is something you need to start working on now if you don't want to be in constant pain your whole adult life.

Damn, I did edit that post, can u check that out.

So what did that first person do?

What do u mean yours extended a little higher?

I remember u mentioned this before, what do your doctors suggest?

i mean that my lower lumbar region had more discs affected. but i think it sounds like your lower, lower discs were worse than mine.

anyways, i was also labeled degenerative disc.. i think this is labeled anytime the discs dont heal within 6 months. normal healthy discs are supposed to heal themselves

i havent gotten an mri in a long time, and i should. i would be curious to see what it says. i know mine said canal stenosis, arthritis as well

it has also affected my shoulders, but moreso only with specific movements. and i played baseball forever so im not entirely sure if i could have torn a labrum or something