Look at this -





You know how you take this man into custody with ease?

Dress like civilians, walk up behind him and get him in a full nelson.

Done.

What they do?

Guns out, rah rah, get down get down! while being many meters away from their guy... giving him a chance to flee, pull out a gun, whatever he wants to do.

How don't they think of this ****? That officer was also in line of sight of getting shot. Lucky he didn't get shot actually, complete morons

I reported a miscer to law enforcement years back, basically the guy made incredibly specific threats towards a school and it was days after one of the more prolific school shootings.

I think I was contacted at least a week later, but the best part was trying to explain to someone paid to investigate threats professionally, and patiently walking him through what Imgur is, that I had uploading a screenshot so he could see what was said, no sense of what a forum was and that posts could be deleted and then restored, etc. There's something kind of relieving about knowing everyone is just as retarded as you are but goddamn, I chose a career in retard, not preventing terrorism

The vast majority of people are incompetent or uncaring to a degree. It's human nature


That being said, two plainclothes officer's sneak-attacking a guy is hardly a better strategy than the one they deployed. It could cause a lot of confusion among witnesses and give the suspect a more legitimate reason to resist and counterattack if he (or a nearby buddy) got the chance

its either that or no knocking and killing the guy and his gerbils. cops are insanely incompetent. a result of prioritizing veterans for hiring. imagine what these a$$holes did to brown muslim people while no one was watching

lol, you're stupid. This is a bad idea for lots of reasons. One is that it would appear to the person he's being attacked by ordinary civilians and he could make a self-defense argument for fighting back.


What the cops should've done, is conducted a felony traffic stop of the man. Had him step out the vehicle with his back to them, all that stuff. It would've been more safe.

Judging by the guy's reaction and the fact he pulled out a gun and was about to shoot a police dog and aimed at an officer, the cops did the best they could. If they tried a traffic stop, guarantee it would've lead to a chase and/or a shoot-out. That would've been exponentially worse

The guy clearly had violent warrants out and was known to be armed and dangerous

Both just wrong, sorry. Not sorry, just saying that to be nice.

Stand in line behind him while he's at the cashier. Full nelson. Other clothed officers come rushing in after you engage. If done right, he wouldn't be able to respond, he'd just be restrained.

Give me an advantageous position on an unsuspecting person, they're going to sleep, chloroformed, and into my van before they even know anything happened

Why not just suckerpunch him? I've watched a lot of cops brah, you can't just sneak attack the suspect. It wouldn't be as good of an idea as you think either

Some people are hard to sleep

If I saw this I would assume it was a kidnapping, and I would respond.

I'm also trying to imagine the absolute meltdown that would have happened if in your scenario, if he hip threw the guy, or if the guy actually trained and pushes a nose through a skull. I really don't grasp the whole concept of plain clothes taking police actions. It seems like a really good way to get shot in the head, like that poor kid who basically got car jacked by a cop and the cop fired a bunch of rounds into his car when the kid (rightfully!) sped away. Poor dear thought he was being kidnapped.especially at a gas station. I'm probably most aware of my surroundings when pumping gas.

So 5 guys suddenly opening a car door, and hastily moving towards him, pointing their guns at him is less risky. Right.

What they did isn't a sneak attack, it was just an attack.

Failing to see how a sneak attack is not allowed, but an outright attack is allowed.

Brb officer, you're not allowed to get that man in a full nelson and take him into custody without anyone even getting injured.
Brb officer(s), 5 of you are allowed to rush an armed suspect with your guns, give him time to pull out his gun, aware him of your presence, allow yourself to almost get shot in the process, and get your dog killed.

But not allowed to sneak attack and as peacefully and effectively as possible restrain the target.

Sense making = 0

You'd assume one grown man subduing another grown man... at a gas station... is kidnapping?

When has such a thing ever happened?

The guy pointed a gun at the dog while guns were pointed at him, but you think they should have approached unarmed and carried out your grappling fantasy?

Skip to 1:00 -



Guy is paying for whatever in the gas station.
Stand behind him.
Full Nelson.
Police buddies come rushing in after you engage to inform others you are the police.
Good game, well played. Done.
To secure victory even more, send in your biggest, Ju-jitsu blackbelt trained cop bro... literally send in a fkin gorrilla, a small guy isn't going to do anything. Gorrila engages from behind. It's goodnight. Just done. He'd be defenseive, literally zero risk. Not zero, nothing is zero. But literally 1/100th the risk compared to the way they engaged in the OP video.

Yeah gas stations usually are a place where people are on high alertThey didn't attack the guy, they confronted him and were forced to attack. In a rear naked choke , the guy will have a few seconds to pull out his gun and blast over his shoulder

A few days ago in Texas. Yeah, if I saw a teenager eating a burger in his car and an attempted carjacking or kidnapping....this shouldn't turn out well for the police. It's actually a little crazy - making, in my state in order to get a concealed license you basically promised that if an officer is ever in distress you'll help. I'm happy to do so. Just not in Texas, I don't trust for a second that these dudes aren't the actual criminals.

So in your fantasy, he can magically tell you're not a civilian, and will shoot anyone that gets witihin 10ft of him. Right, because he was just shooting random civilians that he suspected were cops?

The fact he has a gun is rendered null, due to the fact he doesn't know you're a threat, and that you can get close to him without him knowing you're a cop.

Not a rear naked choke.

Full Nelson.



Good luck being a 150lb guy and reaching for your gun, when a 300lb Ju-Jitsu Chad with a 10 inch cock gets you in a full nelson.

And all said engager would have to do is hold him for 15-20 seconds until other officers rush in.

Lmao. You should reach out to your local police and offer to train them

So guy gets someone in a full nelson at a gas station while shouting, "I'm the police, he's a wanted criminal"

And seconds later, other clothed officers rush in behind.

You'd blow the engagers brains out, because you suspect it's more likely the person is a criminal that wants to ass fuk the actual criminal right in the middle of a gas station, in broad daylight.

Even if a person like you were there, and were a possibility of acting in a way you thought was sound, and shot the said civilian appearing cop, who appeared to be full nelson ass ****ing the criminal... the likelyness of that outcome is STILL less risky that rushing an armed suspect, AND giving him a chance to pull out his gun.

I'd wager 100 to 1 that my method results in less deaths, less injuries, etc. And is 99/100 times the safer method for all parties.... public, police, criminal, dog

You might be right! But I'm still not sure, I think you might be surprised what happens in a few seconds.

Look, I'm approaching this from the perspective that 10 years ago I was told "Pull over immediately if a cop turns on his lights!" And now I am inclined to call 911 before pulling over 100% of the time. I do not believe people that act erratically and violently in public places.

But this here is a completely different scenario. All I see here is men making a spectacle, scaring people trying to get their stupid gas station hot dog, and, well, I don't know what you expert men to do when adrenaline is rushing and a dog is attacking them. I also want to say I don't think this egregiously bad or anything. I think your suggestions sounds dangerous and I'm personally not really a fan of giving agents of the state even more power or even the benefit of the doubt. That makes no sense. They can be normal and pull people over and make arrest warrants like we've always done.

TL;DR both suggestions are a little weird, whatever happened to policing that isn't insane

Was talking to someone about this earlier today. Everything Christopher Dorner was complaining about has been increasingly amplified and spreading ever since he was caught. He went on ranting about his ex cheating, corrupt police, racism against black people, and the City of LA. Literally every word he put out has been the script for the past 8 to 9 years, and it somehow is worse every time something he was complaining about happens again. He was either right, or people are trying to make it look like he was right.

Srs question, what do you do when the guy you're trying to full nelson clamps down on his arms and/or turns on you because he already senses you coming up behind him?

Now you're in a face to face altercation with someone who might draw a weapon quicker than you can

That's what I don't get. bare minimum of training = you feel the person behind us, feel the arms come from behind and feel the closeness of their body to yours, you should already be prepared to resist. At the one place where people with gutter level training still know mostly what to do. I dunno, I appreciate an alternative to what happened in the OP but I still don't see it.I'm pretty sure he was right when his chief was screeching about getting the gas and burning it all down.

OP's proposal is inherently risky to everyone involved by creating physical contact off the bat

I can't think of a better way to confront someone than the officers did in the video either. If they walked up calmly, he still would've probably reacted similarly. If they sneak-attacked him, maybe it'd work in one scenario but backfire badly in another

in my experience, actual police work only happens in movies srs

Well, the point is to take him out and subdue him without giving him a chance to defend himself. Being a clothed officer and doing this makes this possibility not possible. And therefore if you do approach him dressed as an officer, it gives him a chance to defend, and his defense is a gun... it's clearly safer to approach not in uniform.

The clip even shows this is the case, also watch the clip again, you'll see the barrel of the gun is literally pointing directly at one officer at one point. They're lucky none of them got shot.

Anyway, it's without question that subduing him in civilian clothing is safer. This isn't even arguable. I mean the CIA do this stuff all the time. In fact imagine some CIA bro's tailing a target in a uniform that let the person they wanted know who they were. That's clearly silly. This case is literally the same, except it's not cia bro's, it's police bros. The logic is the same though.

This situation is different from pulling over law abiding citizens without wearing identifying police uniforms, due to the fact they know the person is a criminal.

I don't like authorities having any more power than they need to... but I have no issue with them wearing civilian clothing to take down a known criminal.

But even with all this said, and you live in a world of paranoia... and using your own arguments against you here... you said you're not even inclined to pull over if a cop car turns on their lights to pull you over. Then why would you be any more likely to believe a clothed cop subduing a person at a gas station is in fact actually a cop, and not a criminal wearing cop clothing?

You go with probabilities, maybe 1 in 1000 times you'll get juked, and a criminal is pretending to be a cop. Or you just assume the person presenting as a cop is not a cop, hit the gas... get into a a situation where actually cops are now chasing you down the highway at 100miles per hour.

Your arguments just seem unreasonable to me. Sure it's possible a guy subduing another guy in a gas station while shouting "I'm an undercover cop, he's a criminal"... is juking you, and he's actually a criminal that is kidnapping a guy. But surely you don't think that's as likely as the guy actually being a cop by any close margin. Especially given the fact that this altercation would last all of 10 seconds before actual clothed officers came rushing into the gas station. But what, the clothed officers rushing in are actually criminals dressed as cops... and there's this conspiracy to kidnap this poor fellow at the gas station? It's just an absurd way to go about life. Possible? Sure. Likely? Not even close.

This. They’re mostly useful if they are allowed to turn the body cams off and bully panhandlers and other lowlifes srs

Everyone in here is a fukin idiot.

Why even bother with a risky full Nelson when you can just leave a trail of candy from the criminal at the gas station leading back to his jail cell?

Next time you're hanging out with friends that aren't prudes... try this.

Learn how to put someone in a full nelson.
Walk up behind your friend when they're not expecting it an put them in a full nelson.

They're not getting out of it in 30 seconds, their response to resist isn't going to be instant either, they'll literally be in a dominated position before they even know what has happened.

An unsuspecting target is a sitting duck, you don't just turn into Neo from the matrix and respond with instant perfect defense... if you're unsuspecting, you're entirely ****ed. Even the best Ju-Jitsu players in the world would be ****ed if another competent person got the jump on them while they didn't expect it. Utterly ****ed, there's literally not even a defense to be had. Just ****ed.

So the guy in the video was an unsuspecting target/sitting duck? Fuark no, he was a guy with warrants who pulled a gun out within seconds of being confronted in public

Not everyone is sitting ducks either, especially in public when they know they have a reason to be on alert