I think God created Adam and Eve and evolution created black people, hence the different races.

Science and logic shows us all creations have a creator.

Totally agree that live things didn't originate from dead things and don't believe in evolution one bit.

This is just a hypothetical question.

There has to be a point of Origin for all of this. What is/was that?

The hardcore smug neckbeard Atheist/materialist types can't address that.

Yes there’s never been anything incompatible about the two.

I mostly believe in evolution but in the sense of how we observe it and have evidence of it. When I was a kid I was taught some bacteria grew up into all the different forms of life. I find that specific lesson laughable.

However there’s nothing in the Bible that said god created things that couldn’t adapt to changing conditions and environments.

There are however close minded special interest groups on both sides of the discussion who take a markedly stupid stance from both scientific and theological standpoints.

Neither can the hardcore religious folks, given that their smug stance of "god always existed" belies comments (from Blackjack, upthread, for example) such as "Science and logic shows us all creations have a creator." The question of who or what created god is something no religious person can satisfactorily answer.

Sure, the obnoxious and arrogant Atheist/materialist (nothing can possibly outside of our 5 senses) types seem to be more prevalent and vocal than the religious ones though - these days.

Anyone insisting they know/have the answer is an idiot.

If all creations have a creator then who or what created god?

Well that's the thing my friend. God is eternal. You're the typical atheist that doesn't understand that us humans can't wrap our heads around certain things, such as eternity or the divine.

If humans don't know what to make of it, it doesn't exist? Have an open mind and understand that humans aren't as powerful as you think.

My mind is very open. I'm open to the existence of a god/creator - I've yet to any evidence of one though.


I think a mind is just as closed when it responds with "god has always existed" when asked where god came from. It's a cop out. It would be much more intellectually honest to respond with "I don't know", but many religious folks just can't do that and this makes them no better than those who claim the theory of evolution to be fact.

I'll admit I don't know the origin of the universe. No one does. And that includes you.

I'll also admit that the alleged Christian god, a god who would torture his creations for eternity for simply not worshiping him or accepting him sounds like a giant narcissistic sadistic prick. Not a fan of other organized religions either.


The definitive answer of where we came from is yet to be found.

You tell me, OP. How does the theory of evolution question the doctrine of creation? One is a scientific theory to explain the diversity of lifeforms, the other is a metaphysical and theological notion. Why are the two in conflict?

2 words:

Because Bible.

God is eternal, outside of creation. Always was, always will be.

There is no species change of family/class from one to another. All of your “missing links” are known frauds..we can go through them all if you like…but we both know you’ll dodge…like always

Classic god of the gaps. No current explanation, therefore god.

Random mutations never produce functional information, and origin of information always arises from intelligence

The op is being cheeky, but the idea of evolution and creationism can't co-exist because the process of evolution takes millions of years, and believing in the creation theory means you believe the earth is only 2kyo.

This interpretation of reality always bugs me, regardless of which side of the line thinking like this causes them to fall.

There’s no threats, only facts about how things are, my personal interpretations which I am not married to but rather currently favor, doesn’t look at “consequences” as threats. Humans have no idea the complexity involved with bringing about everything we have. There are rules to existence. Do you blame gravity for killing people who choose to jump off buildings?

If you treat the Bible as a personal guidebook for rules to follow that make you live a happy life, it magically works somehow. People living very simple lives happier than you can imagine. Coincidentally when someone breaks the rules even if extremely rich and well off and seem to have it all, they are angry and miserable all the time. Life is like heaven for one despite having nothing you might deem of value, and like hell for another despite “climbing to the top”

Were they punished and rewarded? Or is it just consequences and realities of existence. The arrogance of humans to presume god is doing anything other than allow us to exist in this amazing place that is the world, is truly astounding.

That’s a common Mis-belief. Nowhere in the Bible/Torah does it state how old the earth/universe is. Nowhere. That notion is oftener presented by atheists as dating man back to 6,000 yrs, but this again would be incorrect.

Also, man (Adam/Eve) were created with age. Though only one day old, they had the appearance and biological makeup of those that would be in their 30’s. They were not newborns, it is speculated in many circles of thought that the earth was created with “age” as well.

The handful of times I went to my grandparents Baptist church, that is what they preached.

Everyone faith seems to have their own interpretation (even within the same religious sect) which is where the confusion comes from.

There's also no current explanation for how Earth is one of 10,000 other earth-like planets yet no sign of life. No evolutions happening.

Classic atheist. No rhyme or reason, therefore pure coincidence. Want to know the odds of there not being a God? A billion to the billionth degree based off these chain of events, all supposedly coincidences, put in place for us lucky arrogant humans.

Indeed therefore God. Jesus Christ came and died for our sins. He is our savior. It's on you whether or not to believe. Not him. If you don't believe in him why should he believe in you.

Yep, different side of the same coin - plus he straw manned me anyway (typical smug atheist). I don't say "therefore god" I say I don't know, and anyone claiming to have the answer (one way or the other) is a clown imo.

Most serious Christian philosophers like Plantiga or WLC won't deny the reality of biological evolution, but rather claim that the process is too improbable to have happened by chance and therefore God was required either to set the initial conditions required and/or guide the process along. While also stating that the Biblican account of creation is only allegorical.

The bigger question is how did intelligent life begin. We know what conditions must exist to create life, and most scientists agree these conditions are likely to have existed in other galaxies/exist now. But how did humans evolve to become intelligent, and relatively quickly in the life span of the universe?

I think there must have been some genetic tweaking that occured. Either mushrooms or aliens tho. Maybe God

When I was in undergrad I studied physics and biology, I spent a lot of this time debating, arguing for evolution against everyone on this forum at the time. I won a lot of debates, and thought it was fun. All the stuff was fresh in my head so debating dating (amino acid, molecular clock etc not just radiometric), the origin of things like the eye and the flagellum, all that stuff, that was a blast.

There was a sticky on this subject at one point because there were just SO many threads and active arguments about it. People who really know science can totally turn the screws on anyone arguing against the theory of evolution, if they have the will, but after some years the debate became boring to me personally.

I've progressed in my view of this whole argument, but there are some things that 100% hold true. Scientific creationism, which specifically includes intelligent design is objectively foolish in every context, full stop. It doesn't matter what you saw on youtube. Evolution isn't a scientific controversy, it's only a conteversy among non-experts like politicians, snake oil salesmen and the like.

That being said, if you understand science, understand also the limits of it. Also understand science is defined by something as being falsifiable, which god is NOT. God can be redefined and is objectively subjective. Ask Albert Einstein who was a pantheist, as am I.

More importantly, the "New Atheism", IE: Dawkins, Hitchens, Harris isn't a political panacea for all things political. I see no meaningful distinction from Sam Harris, who thinks thought crimes should be punished (read the end of faith before you atheist dorks argue with me), Christopher Hitchens was an advocate of the genocide in Iraq which was far worse than believing in god in every metric (especially intelligence), and let's be honest, Richard Dawkins is irritating as ****.

God was revealed to us in the 1999 cult classic motion picture Dogma and that's just how it is. God bless, dorks.

Yeah, religious people came up with that idea a long time ago. They call it "Crevolution", whereby God supposedly created the world and organisms in it as we know it today via evolution as the process. You're about 20+ years late to thinking of this.

So was what I was taught in elementary school that amoebas evolved into all intelligent forms still the commonly held belief for evolution? That’s really the only part I have high levels of doubt on, everything else checks out pretty solid. Keep in mind I don’t have any religious skin in the game cuz even if it was amoebas evolving into t-Rex’s I would still see evolution and the Bible as being compatible. I just literally don’t believe based on science that amoebas can turn into huge land animals etc…

There is no species/family change from one to another. Much of what is usually attributed to mutations in the nature is simply adaptation, and that adaptation has today a name, EPIGENETICS. It is a system that does not change the DNA, it regulates gene-expression and does not need those millions of years to do it. In fact a good example of epigenetic adaptation are the Galapagos finches. It was supposed until recently that changes in the size and form of their beaks required time periods typical to the Darwinian explanation, observations have however confirmed that the changes occur continuously (as rapidly is in a couple of years) and are reversible.

That’s the point dummy. Atheists don’t pretend to know. Our position doesn’t depend on explanation for an origin. So either you were implying god of the gaps, or you don’t know what an atheist is and why there is no onus to explain the origin.

So atheists never go "there is no God"?