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Forum » What are the negatives of socialism?
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Thread: What are the negatives of socialism?

post 1630227473 01-31-2021, 09:39 PM
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What are the negatives of socialism?

IMO what Socialism means:

- Everyone makes between $30,000 and $60,000
- Free healthcare
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post 1630227553 01-31-2021, 09:40 PM
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Depends on how its implemented.

Norway, Sweden, Finland and Singapore do it pretty nicely.

I would only support socialism if we had merit based immigrant system. now we can't because there are too many leachers.

Nothing wrong with socialism if the people there work hard and contribute. It also works better in smaller nations. Works great in Finland and Norway but not so great in Spain and France.
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post 1630227593 01-31-2021, 09:41 PM
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People who are dumb and lazy get a free pass in life and make people who work hard pay for them

Absolute bullchit imo
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post 1630227603 01-31-2021, 09:41 PM
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On a personal level? I don't want to cover for your poor choices.

On a big picture level? Innovation will die.
post 1630227743 01-31-2021, 09:42 PM
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- venezuela
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post 1630227783 01-31-2021, 09:43 PM
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“Socialism is the philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy.”

“The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings. The inherent virtue of Socialism is the equal sharing of miseries.”


Both from Winston Churchill
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post 1630227873 01-31-2021, 09:44 PM
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Negatives are less crime. Human beings as a species define themselves through suffering. Take that away, people are bored. The truth is pain, take away the pain, you take away truth
post 1630228133 01-31-2021, 09:49 PM
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It appropriates a herd mentality that indulges in mediocrity, and that everyone's purpose should be uniformally aligned.
post 1630228163 01-31-2021, 09:50 PM
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Straight up socialism just wouldn't work in America. It can work in smaller countries but with the way the constitution is written, how big America is, etc, it just wouldn't work straight up.

I do think some sort of UBI will be mandatory in the future though (obviously) and the sooner and more we admit that and work towards solutions, the better we will be for it. It gets a bad name because "socialism bad" but really it's necessary, and it will keep the benefits of capitalism while adding a lot of the benefits of socialism. I was 100% against it, thinking it was stupid until I did some research on it and actually put more than 5 minutes of thought into it.
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post 1630228473 01-31-2021, 09:53 PM
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Well, OP... I kinda like not starving and owning my own property.
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post 1630228573 01-31-2021, 09:55 PM
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Originally Posted By AgRyan⏩
Straight up socialism just wouldn't work in America.
We have already implemented it for corporations and the wealthy (only without the taxation part). Amazon and Walmart's labor forces are propped up by taxpayers. The airlines got $50B in free money after they saved nothing. We printed $9T for corps during the pandemic. Why do they like it so much? And if they have it, is it fair that we don't? Or should we go back to trying capitalism?
post 1630228713 01-31-2021, 09:57 PM
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Giving money to poor and middle class people is a waste. They'll blow it all on meaningless crap. Only banks and big corporations should benefit from socialism, they do what's right for the greater good. It all trickles down and helps the working class
post 1630228783 01-31-2021, 09:58 PM
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only like 3 out of 10,000 industries should be socialist

doesnt have to be all or nothing

we already have socialist military police firefighters etc who all get paid by taxpayers
post 1630228853 01-31-2021, 09:59 PM
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Originally Posted By AgRyan⏩
Straight up socialism just wouldn't work in America. It can work in smaller countries but with the way the constitution is written, how big America is, etc, it just wouldn't work straight up.

I do think some sort of UBI will be mandatory in the future though (obviously) and the sooner and more we admit that and work towards solutions, the better we will be for it. It gets a bad name because "socialism bad" but really it's necessary, and it will keep the benefits of capitalism while adding a lot of the benefits of socialism. I was 100% against it, thinking it was stupid until I did some research on it and actually put more than 5 minutes of thought into it.
Ubi isn't needed at all and I'll vote against any bill that comes up suggesting it. People are just lazy and want handouts. We live in a Capitalist society where you can be rich anytime, no excuses to need UBI. You just have to work hard
post 1630228993 01-31-2021, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted By MikeLowrrrey⏩
Ubi isn't needed at all. People are just lazy and want handouts. We live in a Capitalist society where you can be rich anytime, no excuses to need UBI. You just have to work hard
This is the way lol.

post 1630229063 01-31-2021, 10:02 PM
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Takes away motivation for excellence and achievements, stalling progress and potentially regressing society in general.

Why spend years of your life inventing a cutting-edge technology, or studying to be a neurosurgeon, if you're not going to be rewarded for it.
post 1630229293 01-31-2021, 10:05 PM
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Originally Posted By bannedjpg⏩
IMO what Socialism means:

- Everyone makes between $30,000 and $60,000
- Free healthcare
The average person in the US has a median income of 31k.
post 1630229483 01-31-2021, 10:06 PM
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Originally Posted By TheJediBrah⏩
Takes away motivation for excellence and achievements, stalling progress and potentially regressing society in general.

Why spend years of your life inventing a cutting-edge technology, or studying to be a neurosurgeon, if you're not going to be rewarded for it.
Ok, NO SOCIALIST, but the idea is that you're supposed to provide a baseline standard of living so that people can prioritize more valuable work than just slaving for Jeff Bozos so you can not die.

That's how US took the lead in tech innovation in the first place. We offered a higher standard of living than poverty countries and stole all the world's big brains. That has pretty much stopped now and may eventually go in reverse as our wealth divide grows bigger and bigger.
post 1630230973 01-31-2021, 10:29 PM
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Originally Posted By ErnieMccracken⏩
We have already implemented it for corporations and the wealthy (only without the taxation part). Amazon and Walmart's labor forces are propped up by taxpayers. The airlines got $50B in free money after they saved nothing. We printed $9T for corps during the pandemic. Why do they like it so much? And if they have it, is it fair that we don't? Or should we go back to trying capitalism?
I don't like socialism for corporations I don't like it for individuals. Not complicated.
post 1630231103 01-31-2021, 10:32 PM
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Originally Posted By ErnieMccracken⏩
Ok, NO SOCIALIST, but the idea is that you're supposed to provide a baseline standard of living so that people can prioritize more valuable work than just slaving for Jeff Bozos so you can not die.

That's how US took the lead in tech innovation in the first place. We offered a higher standard of living than poverty countries and stole all the world's big brains. That has pretty much stopped now and may eventually go in reverse as our wealth divide grows bigger and bigger.
The "but if we provided everyone a safety net with a reasonable standard of living, actually this would spur innovation" is nonsense since you don't see the same levels of innovation that you see in the U.S. as you do in Europe, which does provide that safety net. Intuitively and in practice when you make people comfortable...they become comfortable and don't start businesses / innovate / etc, not to mention the disincentive of high taxes / regulation which are paired with any basic standard of living guarantee.

America had its highest period of growth during the robber baron era of zero regulation / taxation / no safety net / etc of the late 19th and early 20th century. What you're saying has no historical basis whatsoever.
post 1630231343 01-31-2021, 10:34 PM
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Originally Posted By dyee4613⏩
The average FAMILY in the US has a median income of 31k. You want to give that to everyone? ok lol
Median family income in the United States was $68k in 2019. No idea where you are getting that number from.

Source:https://www.census.gov/library/publi...0Table%20A%2D1).
post 1630231373 01-31-2021, 10:35 PM
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Originally Posted By BrightThru2014⏩
I don't like socialism for corporations I don't like it for individuals. Not complicated.
If you support either major political party, you support socialism. Full stop.
post 1630231483 01-31-2021, 10:37 PM
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Originally Posted By BrightThru2014⏩
Median family income in the United States was $68k in 2019. No idea where you are getting that number from.

Source:https://www.census.gov/library/publi...0Table%20A%2D1).
I'm an idiot. I googled Median income in the US instead of family income. Good catch.
post 1630231553 01-31-2021, 10:38 PM
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Originally Posted By Mountaineer92⏩
- venezuela
- cuba
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most people in russia will tell you the dissolution of the soviet union is the worst thing to ever happen to russia
post 1630231603 01-31-2021, 10:39 PM
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There are definitely aspects of socialism that can be implemented in the USA and would do well. National health insurance, for example. Would save us so much money it’s insane. But both republicans and democrats are in bed with insurance companies and big pharma.
post 1630231683 01-31-2021, 10:41 PM
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Originally Posted By babyshark99⏩
There are definitely aspects of socialism that can be implemented in the USA and would do well. National health insurance, for example. Would save us so much money it’s insane. But both republicans and democrats are in bed with insurance companies and big pharma.
What do you mean by national health insurance? Are you talking about eliminating state borders so health insurance companies have to compete nationwide for the best rates?
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post 1630231703 01-31-2021, 10:41 PM
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Originally Posted By ErnieMccracken⏩
If you support either major political party, you support socialism. Full stop.
I support the party that is less in favor of socialism. Which is objectively the Republican party (and to claim otherwise is factually incorrect). Neither of the parties really represent my views so I vote for the lesser of two evils, welcome to democracy.
post 1630231713 01-31-2021, 10:41 PM
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Originally Posted By 8pieces⏩
most people in russia will tell you the dissolution of the soviet union is the worst thing to ever happen to russia
Having lived in the USSR when it collapsed, I can tell you it had nothing to do with socialism.
post 1630231803 01-31-2021, 10:42 PM
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Originally Posted By ClivesTriceps⏩
What do you mean by national health insurance? Are you talking about eliminating state borders so health insurance companies have to compete nationwide for the best rates?
If you look at countries where the government supplies the health insurance, like France, Canada, pretty much the entire world, you will see they pay less per person than we currently do and they have a healthier population with better health outcomes and longer life expectancy.
post 1630231893 01-31-2021, 10:43 PM
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Originally Posted By babyshark99⏩
If you look at countries where the government supplies the health insurance, like France, Canada, pretty much the entire world, you will see they pay less per person than we currently do and they have a healthier population with better health outcomes and longer life expectancy.
Yeah and all of the new medicines and cutting edge procedures that they use to keep that population healthy is developed in the United States. Where do you think the rich in those countries go when they get ill? Thank God that some countries do capitalism and subsidize the well being of the rest of the world.

The unequal health outcomes and longer life expectancy have far more to do with lifestyle choices by the average citizen than the healthcare system.
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