Food stamps and housing seems like a simple minimum

Do I want to pay for people to not work while breeding more non-workers for me to pay for?

That's an easy no.

Sure rather my taxes stay at home then go to useless military personnel to sweep out bays

How are they rizzing with only housing and food stamps?

More a minimum. Vouchers can distort the market, so maybe there are more complicated economics to it.

How about labor camps?

Kinda but not really. UBI is just welfare, I get why it appeals to some people over welfare but I personally would like to keep welfare obviously welfare so it can be kept track of easier.

I support the gov providing a baseline housing situation to anyone who doesn't abuse it. But like very basic accom, on par with a prison cell. Same deal with food. I think a lot of welfare should come in this format, I'm looking hard at single moms here.

Also I think it should be weighed against how much the person has contributed in the past, like if some person has paid their taxes, done the right thing by society in general for 20 years and they fall on hard times they should get a nicer housing situation over some LDAR who has never contributed. But I still think we should provide everyone at least a safe box to sleep and store a few things so long as they respect it.

Must be hard to crawl out of that hole if you can't even keep some things safe / get a decent sleep / have an address.

So mostly agree with what your suggesting just a bit different to UBI housing in implementation.

What percentage increase in taxes are YOU willing to pay for this nonsense?

Everyone has an idea on how to increase government spending but no clue on reducing it

Do you think women need money to breed?

Tax the middle class!

Qatar does UBI for men only.

Money is already spent on housing welfare and homelessness comes with costs to the government and society in general

Abolish the federal income tax, people would have a lot more money

OP explain how UBI works please? I fail to see how giving people money they didn't earn is sustainable long term. A lesson taught by Adam Smith said something like "The true wealth of a nation is the goods/services it produces, not the amount of currency." Like thats great that you can just give people money but the natural state of humans is to be lazy so those who can use it to produce less will. With production slowing then you end up with more inflation and people whining that they need more UBI and you just end up in never ending cycle

Trump did a test run of it.

All the money went right back into the pockets of the rich.

I'll pass.

exactly like food stamps. Some minimal infrastructure is not the worst idea.

Would you like everyone to start out in a place with no law enforcement and try to build everything with violent criminals around them so they do not start with too much free support?

I got a lot of ideas on reducing it

Bingo!

Fuk that

We are absolutely fuked. AI is going to take all of the jobs.

Since no one is working they could socialize the profits, but then you run into socalist problems of price controls, and lack of incentive to actually produce the goods, leading to shortages.


Basically we all become slaves.

Ok well if it works "exactly like food stamps" its going to be an emphatic NO from me. If it were my choice I would make it drastically harder for people to get food stamps. It has created a system of people dependent on government because there is no incentive to get off the dole because again, humans are by nature lazy. Like overall there has been minimal success with any government incentivized programs.

Also I'm not sure why you veered off the topic to talk about violent crime, that is a direct result of the moral hazard governments cause when they are soft on crime. Look at major democrat run cities for example.

UBI would inspire more drug overdose and suicide than anything else you could possibly do to a population.

I'd become Amish if society ever advanced to the point of UBI.

I would prefer no welfare (unless you're physically disabled or fully retarded) as most people on it are able bodied and could get a job. Kormo is a great example of this.

Our economy is already distorted by government and the government has been corrupted by various interest groups.




This isn't mine, but can you really dispute it?




Are you aware of the story that real economic growth ended around the time the US abandoned the gold standard and that we have just been devaluing the currency since then?

A lot of people who hate government spending on social services are totally good with government spending on the MIC or bailing out big corporations or whatever, and we already spend a LOT of money on non-productive work which is mostly rent-seeking.

Our present system is not sustainable long term and this has been known for quite some time IMO. At the very least since 2008. We have built a mind-boggling pile of debt which we have pretended will paid for by "the next guy". Meanwhile there aren't enough "next guys" in the pipeline to possible make good on those old promises [low birth rates].

UBI is a kludge, a make do solution to try and cushion the fall. I supported it as a replacement for present welfare programs which all have their own paid bureaucracies and BS forms and rules. ATM I believe that a paid benefit to all children [yes, all children] + a negative income tax is likely the best option.

The reverse income tax would be a subsidy for low paid workers to bring them up to a better living standard. There would be some sort of annual floor set re: good enough living standard and people who don't earn at least the base level income would get a boost upwards. Perhaps people between the base level + 20% would pay no income tax at all and then taxation would begin above that income.

"Oh no, I shouldn't have to pay for other peoples' children woman! WTH!" Yeah, yeah, yeah...

Those children shouldn't be saddled with decades of debt that they never incurred either, but here we are so tough biscuit cookie.

If we had any good sense to speak of then there would be a legit movement to raise better children- meaning well fed, well educated, properly socialized and not abused or bogged down w/bad parent BS. Not out of charity- out of simple good sense and the desire for self-preservation.

Instead TPTB are throwing wads of funny money at stupid crap like net zero and smart cities. We need the best quality humans we can muster to keep us going during this bottleneck we are hurtling towards.

I think it is the only way forward tbh.

Everyone gets on the case of benefits and handouts, but you don’t hear much chat about all the bullchit and nonsense jobs that are being created, just so people can “earn a living”.

I think we gotta be honest about what automation, labour saving devices and technology are doing to the work landscape and adapt accordingly.

Having food and shelter should be a basic right. It shouldn’t be luxurious though and obviously just enough to cover your survival needs. If you want money for extra **** in life, e.g. better food, a bigger house, etc, then you can go out and find some part-time or full-time work.

Don’t worry it’s coming OP. It will be shortly introduced when they collapse the banks and rollout CBDC. This will also be tied health/vaccine status, social credit score, carbon emission use, miles traveled, etc. it’s already happening in a few countries, just a matter of time before it gets here. I’d say February 2024 if I had to guess.

Same thing I say about $10k, $20k, whatever "college loan debt forgiveness".

Just as soon as the people asking for these massive free handouts and the government sign off on me getting a direct deposit of the same amount of money into my bank account as they get to relieve their debt problems/money they get to buy houses and chit, I'll support it.

I'm just fed up with seeing mostly the same damn type of people take, take, take at the expense of the taxpayers when I've never gotten government money aside from the stimulus checks most people got during covid. Meanwhile we got people getting like 50% - 100% of their lifestyle funded by the government. People like that can get bent.

No.

I'm not necessarily for this idea, but negative progressive tax rates for the lowest income workers as a replacement for welfare. Would encourage people to be employed for their handout instead of penalizing them for getting a job.

^^^
This is the argument for a reverse income tax instead of a UBI.
IDK why so many people seem to believe that food stamps are a generous benefit that make it worth it to remain in poverty.

Cliffs:

- food stamps are based on something called the Thrifty Food Plan
- they assume that you can spend 30% of you income for food
- your benefit is based on total income - allowed expenses [completely unrealistic] - X .30 = your food budget
- they pay you the difference between the Thrifty Food Plan and your food budget *per their calculation*, not based on your real expenses^^^
Would you choose to stay in poverty for an average benefit of $169 per month only good for purchasing food?
The need for a sense of purpose is a real thing IMO. Though not everyone needs paid employment to have a sense of purpose in life.
Cash welfare is almost totally extinct since the Clinton administration. Social Security Disability is a different program which benefits the disabled.

What was your original account?
I can’t remember anyone that ever brought up they liked Dio.. Holy Diver & Rainbow in the Dark are 2 of my favs.