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» Construction workers union pushing for AUD$240,000 entry wage
04-30-2024, 09:03 PM
#31
Originally Posted By JackyChin⏩
That's not happening. Business's are struggling to get tradesman, because not many of them are taking on apprentices. They want 5 years experience or no job.
Honestly this is the most bubble thing ever. It takes, what, 2 years to learn a trade to the entry level? With essentially no barrier to entry, right?
Prepare for the massive influx of people into the trades driving prices back to $60k/yr for backbreaking labor.
Prepare for the massive influx of people into the trades driving prices back to $60k/yr for backbreaking labor.
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04-30-2024, 09:13 PM
#32
Originally Posted By InPhase⏩
Uh, they’re not taking in apprentices because there are no kids going into the apprenticeships
That's not happening. Business's are struggling to get tradesman, because not many of them are taking on apprentices. They want 5 years experience or no job.
It’s essentially 3 years of heavily subsidised labour for them, and in some cases like builders the Master Builders Association pays for them (out of union dues admittedly, but it’s zero cost to the actual builder)
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04-30-2024, 09:20 PM
#33
So is that like 40k USD?
Edit. It's about 150k USD. Almost UPS union pay. Nice
Edit. It's about 150k USD. Almost UPS union pay. Nice
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04-30-2024, 09:58 PM
#34
Originally Posted By bsrkoacar2⏩
…for an entry-level worker.
So is that like 40k USD?
Edit. It's about 150k USD. Almost UPS union pay. Nice
Edit. It's about 150k USD. Almost UPS union pay. Nice
That’s the starting point. Not the end point.
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04-30-2024, 10:13 PM
#35
Originally Posted By r32gojirra⏩
The economy has fundamentally changed but people haven’t updated their ideas about trades
1) boomers see trades as being less prestigious so push their kids into university
2) boomers in Australia got free uni. Now a useful degree is $100’s of thousands, but the debt doesn’t factor into people’s thinking. Nor the time out of the workforce while studying.
3) the highest tax rate (49%) used to capture maybe the top 2% of earners. Now it’s 30% or more. So it’s not how much you earn but how much you keep.
4) even if the tradie and white collar worker are on the SAME pay, the tradie is hundreds of thousands of dollars better off due to how our tax system works
5) a three year degree used to be enough to get a good job. Now it’s 5 years plus post grad plus professional year, so at least 7 years. Tradies do a 3 year aprenticeship starting as young as 16
6) houses did not used to be a way to generate such massive wealth. Now that a house is worth multiples of a yearly salary, AND they changed the tax laws to exempt them from tax, tradies who have a builders license can make millions for free.
7) tradies including builders used to make a pretty crappy wage. Now with the labour shortages they write their own cheques.
Two other factors:
8) if you are a trade or consultant that has an ounce of customer service skill you are set. Most trades will issue a quote and say “that’s it, don’t like it **** off”. If you take 5 minutes to explain why it costs that, what are the options/risks etc your clients love you and you are like gold. I have consultants and trades like this and I never look elsewhere.
9) all the successful tradies I know have a mentor in the game, who has put them onto a good accountant and got in their ear about starting a business, investing etc. this doesn’t happen in white collar fields. Some that didn’t have a mentor piss their money away on holidays and gambling and drugs etc
1) boomers see trades as being less prestigious so push their kids into university
2) boomers in Australia got free uni. Now a useful degree is $100’s of thousands, but the debt doesn’t factor into people’s thinking. Nor the time out of the workforce while studying.
3) the highest tax rate (49%) used to capture maybe the top 2% of earners. Now it’s 30% or more. So it’s not how much you earn but how much you keep.
4) even if the tradie and white collar worker are on the SAME pay, the tradie is hundreds of thousands of dollars better off due to how our tax system works
5) a three year degree used to be enough to get a good job. Now it’s 5 years plus post grad plus professional year, so at least 7 years. Tradies do a 3 year aprenticeship starting as young as 16
6) houses did not used to be a way to generate such massive wealth. Now that a house is worth multiples of a yearly salary, AND they changed the tax laws to exempt them from tax, tradies who have a builders license can make millions for free.
7) tradies including builders used to make a pretty crappy wage. Now with the labour shortages they write their own cheques.
Two other factors:
8) if you are a trade or consultant that has an ounce of customer service skill you are set. Most trades will issue a quote and say “that’s it, don’t like it **** off”. If you take 5 minutes to explain why it costs that, what are the options/risks etc your clients love you and you are like gold. I have consultants and trades like this and I never look elsewhere.
9) all the successful tradies I know have a mentor in the game, who has put them onto a good accountant and got in their ear about starting a business, investing etc. this doesn’t happen in white collar fields. Some that didn’t have a mentor piss their money away on holidays and gambling and drugs etc
Originally Posted By r32gojirra⏩
…for an entry-level worker.
That’s the starting point. Not the end point.
That’s the starting point. Not the end point.
Cool. Let me know when the union and the management there make that union contract with those starting wages official rather than still being in the beginning bargaining phases
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04-30-2024, 10:17 PM
#36
Originally Posted By FelixTheCat1919⏩
No worries.
Cool. Let me know when the union and the management there make that union contract with those starting wages official rather than still being in the beginning bargaining phases
In the interim just note that all the fully qualified trades I deal with are on $200k+ and turning away work.
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04-30-2024, 10:30 PM
#37
Originally Posted By r32gojirra⏩
Bull****. The number of applicants they get is pretty high. I've many friends who work on the victorian big builds. It's just the number they are offering is so small.
Uh, they’re not taking in apprentices because there are no kids going into the apprenticeships
It’s essentially 3 years of heavily subsidised labour for them, and in some cases like builders the Master Builders Association pays for them (out of union dues admittedly, but it’s zero cost to the actual builder)
It’s essentially 3 years of heavily subsidised labour for them, and in some cases like builders the Master Builders Association pays for them (out of union dues admittedly, but it’s zero cost to the actual builder)
The government's own figures show apprentice numbers are nothing compared to what they were 20 years ago. Business doesn't want to deal with training people now, they just expect ready made fully qualified tradesman. I've worked in these business's since the 90's. My company used to take on apprentices every year. Now they haven't done it since 2016.
04-30-2024, 10:31 PM
#38
Originally Posted By r32gojirra⏩
No worries.
In the interim just note that all the fully qualified trades I deal with are on $200k+ and turning away work.
In the interim just note that all the fully qualified trades I deal with are on $200k+ and turning away work.
We've already established that Aussie money is not the same as U.S. money. $200k there is about $130k in the U.S., so a pretty big difference. I'm also assuming you're talking about people who work in major cities like Sydney. $130k USD ain't that great in major U.S. cities these days, either.
Not even chitting on trades. They do really well for themselves. But you're making it seem a bit more glorious than it actually is.
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04-30-2024, 10:41 PM
#39
Originally Posted By FelixTheCat1919⏩
Lucky they're not spending their AUD in the US then I guess?
We've already established that Aussie money is not the same as U.S. money. $200k there is about $130k in the U.S., so a pretty big difference. I'm also assuming you're talking about people who work in major cities like Sydney. $130k USD ain't that great in major U.S. cities these days, either.
Not even chitting on trades. They do really well for themselves. But you're making it seem a bit more glorious than it actually is.
Not even chitting on trades. They do really well for themselves. But you're making it seem a bit more glorious than it actually is.
04-30-2024, 11:04 PM
#40
Please define this 240k entry level "tradie"
I think we are way past apprentice electrician/plumber now.
I think we are way past apprentice electrician/plumber now.
05-01-2024, 12:52 AM
#41
Originally Posted By FelixTheCat1919⏩
No as I already mentioned this is Brisbane, which is much lower COL than Sydney.
We've already established that Aussie money is not the same as U.S. money. $200k there is about $130k in the U.S., so a pretty big difference. I'm also assuming you're talking about people who work in major cities like Sydney. $130k USD ain't that great in major U.S. cities these days, either.
Not even chitting on trades. They do really well for themselves. But you're making it seem a bit more glorious than it actually is.
Not even chitting on trades. They do really well for themselves. But you're making it seem a bit more glorious than it actually is.
Awful lot of cope going on ITT
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Originally Posted By AlexxVann⏩
Also correct
Lucky they're not spending their AUD in the US then I guess?
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05-01-2024, 12:53 AM
#42
Originally Posted By aal04⏩
As noted in the article entry level means no experience.
Please define this 240k entry level "tradie"
I think we are way past apprentice electrician/plumber now.
I think we are way past apprentice electrician/plumber now.
The agreement includes traffic controllers and cleaners lol. Are they even trades? Hilarious.
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05-01-2024, 03:58 AM
#43
Originally Posted By swoleyo⏩
damn these tradies are outta control running wild
LOL that's because all you useless ****s can't even get a toilet to stop leaking.
As a union tradesmen I'm making so much money right now because people don't have any skills anymore. Can't do electric, plumbing, even paint a wall.
Yeah bro, I'll do it for you. Give me 500 dollars to come out and we'll go from there. Also show me your wife, I need to borrow her.
As a union tradesmen I'm making so much money right now because people don't have any skills anymore. Can't do electric, plumbing, even paint a wall.
Yeah bro, I'll do it for you. Give me 500 dollars to come out and we'll go from there. Also show me your wife, I need to borrow her.
05-01-2024, 04:19 AM
#44
Originally Posted By r32gojirra⏩
The economy has fundamentally changed but people haven’t updated their ideas about trades
1) boomers see trades as being less prestigious so push their kids into university
2) boomers in Australia got free uni. Now a useful degree is $100’s of thousands, but the debt doesn’t factor into people’s thinking. Nor the time out of the workforce while studying.
3) the highest tax rate (49%) used to capture maybe the top 2% of earners. Now it’s 30% or more. So it’s not how much you earn but how much you keep.
4) even if the tradie and white collar worker are on the SAME pay, the tradie is hundreds of thousands of dollars better off due to how our tax system works
5) a three year degree used to be enough to get a good job. Now it’s 5 years plus post grad plus professional year, so at least 7 years. Tradies do a 3 year aprenticeship starting as young as 16
6) houses did not used to be a way to generate such massive wealth. Now that a house is worth multiples of a yearly salary, AND they changed the tax laws to exempt them from tax, tradies who have a builders license can make millions for free.
7) tradies including builders used to make a pretty crappy wage. Now with the labour shortages they write their own cheques.
Two other factors:
8) if you are a trade or consultant that has an ounce of customer service skill you are set. Most trades will issue a quote and say “that’s it, don’t like it **** off”. If you take 5 minutes to explain why it costs that, what are the options/risks etc your clients love you and you are like gold. I have consultants and trades like this and I never look elsewhere.
9) all the successful tradies I know have a mentor in the game, who has put them onto a good accountant and got in their ear about starting a business, investing etc. this doesn’t happen in white collar fields. Some that didn’t have a mentor piss their money away on holidays and gambling and drugs etc
1) boomers see trades as being less prestigious so push their kids into university
2) boomers in Australia got free uni. Now a useful degree is $100’s of thousands, but the debt doesn’t factor into people’s thinking. Nor the time out of the workforce while studying.
3) the highest tax rate (49%) used to capture maybe the top 2% of earners. Now it’s 30% or more. So it’s not how much you earn but how much you keep.
4) even if the tradie and white collar worker are on the SAME pay, the tradie is hundreds of thousands of dollars better off due to how our tax system works
5) a three year degree used to be enough to get a good job. Now it’s 5 years plus post grad plus professional year, so at least 7 years. Tradies do a 3 year aprenticeship starting as young as 16
6) houses did not used to be a way to generate such massive wealth. Now that a house is worth multiples of a yearly salary, AND they changed the tax laws to exempt them from tax, tradies who have a builders license can make millions for free.
7) tradies including builders used to make a pretty crappy wage. Now with the labour shortages they write their own cheques.
Two other factors:
8) if you are a trade or consultant that has an ounce of customer service skill you are set. Most trades will issue a quote and say “that’s it, don’t like it **** off”. If you take 5 minutes to explain why it costs that, what are the options/risks etc your clients love you and you are like gold. I have consultants and trades like this and I never look elsewhere.
9) all the successful tradies I know have a mentor in the game, who has put them onto a good accountant and got in their ear about starting a business, investing etc. this doesn’t happen in white collar fields. Some that didn’t have a mentor piss their money away on holidays and gambling and drugs etc
brb, all medical school bros in Australia who are not soyos pivot-maxing into trades it seems
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05-01-2024, 04:28 AM
#45
Originally Posted By r32gojirra⏩
As noted in the article entry level means no experience.
The agreement includes traffic controllers and cleaners lol. Are they even trades? Hilarious.
The agreement includes traffic controllers and cleaners lol. Are they even trades? Hilarious.
How many times do I need to explain to you that a union's initial proposal to the management of the company they work for is not the same thing as the final result? Wait until it actually goes through before you start celebrating on behalf of tradies. That's all I'm trying to say.
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05-01-2024, 04:42 AM
#46
Originally Posted By r32gojirra⏩
Your government is already taking your money to give to these fukheads. You already have communism.
Remember: United you bargain. Divided, you beg.
bUt mUh cOmMuNiSm!!!1!1!
bUt mUh cOmMuNiSm!!!1!1!
05-01-2024, 04:46 AM
#47
Originally Posted By FelixTheCat1919⏩
How many times do I have to explain to you that it’s only a $15k rise relative to what they’re already on
How many times do I need to explain to you that a union's initial proposal to the management of the company they work for is not the same thing as the final result? Wait until it actually goes through before you start celebrating on behalf of tradies. That's all I'm trying to say.
Keeping coping soyo
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05-01-2024, 04:48 AM
#48
Originally Posted By r32gojirra⏩
How many times do I have to explain to you that it’s only a $15k rise relative to what they’re already on
Keeping coping soyo
Keeping coping soyo
If it's so great, then why haven't you made a move to do it and join a trade yourself? And who are you, an admitted officecel, to call others soys? lol
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05-01-2024, 04:51 AM
#49
Originally Posted By FelixTheCat1919⏩
Because you can’t become an apprentice beyond a certain age. I know this because I asked lol.
If it's so great, then why haven't you made a move to do it and join a trade yourself? And who are you, an admitted officecel, to call others soys? lol
I already earn multiples of what even well paid tradies bring in, albeit paying more tax on the income part.
Also my office is in my house and most of my money is from property development, (which is why I deal with so many trades) not my job income.
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05-01-2024, 04:52 AM
#50
Originally Posted By r32gojirra⏩
Because you can’t become an apprentice beyond a certain age. I know this because I asked lol.
Also my office is in my house and most of my money is from property development, (which is why I deal with so many trades) not my job income.
Also my office is in my house and most of my money is from property development, (which is why I deal with so many trades) not my job income.
Look, I just want to say I'm sorry if I seemed overly rude at any point in this discussion. You have yourself a good day, my guy, srs.
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05-01-2024, 07:31 AM
#51
I call bs sounds to good to be true
05-01-2024, 07:35 AM
#52
Originally Posted By r32gojirra⏩
So 10 obese gen z x tradies who don't know how to hammer a nail on wall, is what 2,5mil a year? Who's paying for that?
As noted in the article entry level means no experience.
The agreement includes traffic controllers and cleaners lol. Are they even trades? Hilarious.
The agreement includes traffic controllers and cleaners lol. Are they even trades? Hilarious.
Who? Listen to uraelf you're not making any sense fake news
05-01-2024, 01:08 PM
#53
Originally Posted By JackyChin⏩
Honestly this is the most bubble thing ever. It takes, what, 2 years to learn a trade to the entry level? With essentially no barrier to entry, right?
Prepare for the massive influx of people into the trades driving prices back to $60k/yr for backbreaking labor.
Prepare for the massive influx of people into the trades driving prices back to $60k/yr for backbreaking labor.
It doesn't work that way. If there's to many people in the trade the apprenticeship school will stop taking new students. The unions won't allow there to be a massive surplus of labor.
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05-01-2024, 03:25 PM
#54
Originally Posted By swoleyo⏩
The shortage of apprentices is so bad the main unions had a conference with the Federal Government for a week - including the Prime Minister - to try and figure out how to get more apprentices
It doesn't work that way. If there's to many people in the trade the apprenticeship school will stop taking new students. The unions won't allow there to be a massive surplus of labor.
I think their solution ended up being to get more women into trades lmao
Edit: they also made it free to do the technical college (TAFE, for ausbrahs) for in-demand trades. It was already basically free but anyway.
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05-01-2024, 04:23 PM
#55
Originally Posted By r32gojirra⏩
Sounds like something Bodhy could get into to better his situation.
The shortage of apprentices is so bad the main unions had a conference with the Federal Government for a week - including the Prime Minister - to try and figure out how to get more apprentices
I think their solution ended up being to get more women into trades lmao
Edit: they also made it free to do the technical college (TAFE, for ausbrahs) for in-demand trades. It was already basically free but anyway.
I think their solution ended up being to get more women into trades lmao
Edit: they also made it free to do the technical college (TAFE, for ausbrahs) for in-demand trades. It was already basically free but anyway.
They would help with his hygiene issues, his "autism", his current BMI and in general put some hair on his chest.
He could start contributing to society finally.
But who am I kidding, he wouldn't last 30 minutes with tradies.
05-01-2024, 07:21 PM
#56
Originally Posted By Anachron⏩
Sounds like something Bodhy could get into to better his situation.
They would help with his hygiene issues, his "autism", his current BMI and in general put some hair on his chest.
He could start contributing to society finally.
But who am I kidding, he wouldn't last 30 minutes with tradies.
They would help with his hygiene issues, his "autism", his current BMI and in general put some hair on his chest.
He could start contributing to society finally.
But who am I kidding, he wouldn't last 30 minutes with tradies.
Why are you always mean? say something nice about the guy
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05-01-2024, 08:22 PM
#57
Originally Posted By swoleyo⏩
How about you go first?
Why are you always mean? say something nice about the guy
05-01-2024, 10:06 PM
#58
Originally Posted By swoleyo⏩
He's really good at **** smearing on walls, and taking tranny dick.
Why are you always mean? say something nice about the guy
05-01-2024, 10:23 PM
#59
The union is a joke. Its funny how you NEVER see this in corporate.
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05-02-2024, 12:01 AM
#60
Originally Posted By 24HrParking⏩
How is the union a joke?
The union is a joke. Its funny how you NEVER see this in corporate.
It’s achieving the one thing it was set up to do.
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