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Forum » ** Official Florida Shooting Endless Argument Thread **
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Thread: ** Official Florida Shooting Endless Argument Thread **

post 1543900581 02-15-2018, 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted By BigBallsMcgee⏩
this isnt call of duty. Guns are not an equalizer it depends on how your skill level. A lot of people arent good enough to execute under pressure in that kind of situation anyway.

The great equalizer would be nobody has a gun
You have no idea what you're talking about. "Nobody has a gun" means that the physically strongest can run roughshod over the weak (e.g., women and the elderly).

Guns are absolutely an equalizer, in that they give somebody a chance to defend themselves that doesn't rely on physical strength. We have cases of handicapped people and women fending off much larger able-bodied men thanks to guns.
post 1543900601 02-15-2018, 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted By Caeculus⏩
Probably already been said but I'm not reading 1,100 posts to find out.

The guy was obviously mentally disturbed but I think he was another ER forever alone type that wanted to destroy other people and give himself a sense that he has power in this world when really he was just another average expendable male without a purpose in life and without a woman and that's why he chose Valentine's Day to do this.
They never really get into why this kind of **** happens. They talk about wanting to address the issue but then do everything possible to ignore the real reason so many young men feel this anger
post 1543900611 02-15-2018, 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted By midcoastking33⏩
Can we stop with the hypothetical "what if the government turned on us" spiel at least? We all know a vast majority of servicemen would defect if such a situation would arise
Brah if you think the US elites don't have a solid, full proof plan to wipe out anyone who tries to harm them (with or without rebellious servicemen) then I don't even know what to say. It's 2018. The weapons they have will blow your mind.

Not to mention they could just destroy the electricity grids and water supplies and watch everyone drop like flies within a few weeks.

They have this all planned and under control. They're ready when you're ready.
post 1543900751 02-15-2018, 12:09 PM
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Originally Posted By MiscInformed⏩
In what way? Do you mean to imply that school shootings will soon be replaced by mustard gas attacks by emo teenagers, or that terrorists will use airborne pathogens to kill people by the thousands?

I'll tell you one thing for sure, having a DISARMED population surely wouldn't prevent either of those types of incidents.
Nah. I mean guns are for fighting the government, how valuable are bullets when fighting chemical/biological warfare which will be used by the elites?
post 1543901011 02-15-2018, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted By Lucianus⏩
Brah if you think the US elites don't have a solid, full proof plan to wipe out anyone who tries to harm them (with or without rebellious servicemen) then I don't even know what to say. It's 2018. The weapons they have will blow your mind.

Not to mention they could just destroy the electricity grids and water supplies and watch everyone drop like flies within a few weeks.

They have this all planned and under control. They're ready when you're ready.
Very cool conspiracy theory you just completely pulled out of your ass.

The elites, whether in 2018 or throughout history, have existed with the acquiescence (or apathy) of the masses. When the masses turned on the elites, the uniform pattern has remained the same: things have gone very, very poorly for the elites.
post 1543901051 02-15-2018, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted By Future24⏩
If you really believe you can fight the US government with your little guns, you are beyond stupid.
Look at the middle east who have fought off nearly every super-power with small arms.

CONTROLLING territory is VASTLY different from winning a war. This is routinely taught in war college. This goes back to the occupation of India by Britain. It simply became unsustainable.

Imagine if we had a military coup, you wouldn't see the value in having an armed population?
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post 1543901081 02-15-2018, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted By midcoastking33⏩
Can we stop with the hypothetical "what if the government turned on us" spiel at least? We all know a vast majority of servicemen would defect if such a situation would arise
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o..._coup_attempts

It's not a function to be exercised everyday, but when needed.

Also there's the other issue about firearms being used in self defense everyday. So notwithstanding a coup, they still have a substantial use in that regard.
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post 1543901421 02-15-2018, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted By midcoastking33⏩
Can we stop with the hypothetical "what if the government turned on us" spiel at least? We all know a vast majority of servicemen would defect if such a situation would arise
Army? yes. Executive branch departments with police powers well beyond what they need? No.

Example 1. Waco, TX.

Refresh your memory on that. It was outrageous what the Clinton administration did there. Outrageous. That was not even 25 years ago. Not a single government employee was held culpable and most of them got raises and promotions. Career federal bureaucrats care more about their patrons (politicians) and their pay, than their fellow citizens. It was proven there. No cooler heads stepped forward to de-escalate the situation. No cooler heads thought that it would be easier to apprehend the leader of the Branch Davidians while he was out and about around town. They wanted a PR coup. They arrived with newsmen and armed to the teeth. They conducted a military style assault for no reason other to show off their shiny new toys. A whole lot of women and children died there for no good reason. If people like that don't scare you, they should.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3B7iWE1PrA

Janet Reno and Bill Clinton eventually brought in tanks and burned them all alive after a lengthy siege.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWE4n4A4N9g
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post 1543901461 02-15-2018, 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted By TunaTunaTuna⏩
Very cool conspiracy theory you just completely pulled out of your ass.

The elites, whether in 2018 or throughout history, have existed with the acquiescence (or apathy) of the masses. When the masses turned on the elites, the uniform pattern has remained the same: things have gone very, very poorly for the elites.
Conspiracy? The elites haven't built up this enormous wealth and power for John Doe from Bumfuk Nowhere to intimidate them with a gun.

You can say "throughout history" but NEVER has there been a time where they can more easily wipe out massive populations within minutes.

Look what they done to the US troops in Vietnam, treated them like scum. Look what they're doing with their proxy wars in Afghan & Iraq. Obama coming in saying he'll pull everyone out, yet troops still die.

They don't give a chit about you. Threaten their lives and it's game over.
post 1543901491 02-15-2018, 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted By Lucianus⏩
Brah if you think the US elites don't have a solid, full proof plan to wipe out anyone who tries to harm them (with or without rebellious servicemen) then I don't even know what to say. It's 2018. The weapons they have will blow your mind.

Not to mention they could just destroy the electricity grids and water supplies and watch everyone drop like flies within a few weeks.

They have this all planned and under control. They're ready when you're ready.
You need tons of people on board (everyday citizens, not just the "governement"). Armed citizens can outlast a small group of government leaders, and definitely longer than a few weeks. Not only that, there would be casualties on all sides and foreign states with an agenda assisting all sides. If "elites" had full proof plans, we wouldn't have Syria, Iraq, Vietnam, Venezuela type situations.

Said it better than me:
Originally Posted By TunaTunaTuna⏩
Very cool conspiracy theory you just completely pulled out of your ass.

The elites, whether in 2018 or throughout history, have existed with the acquiescence (or apathy) of the masses. When the masses turned on the elites, the uniform pattern has remained the same: things have gone very, very poorly for the elites.
Chaos and apocalypse on us all
Let them burn to dust.

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post 1543901671 02-15-2018, 12:18 PM
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Originally Posted By canonhope⏩
You need tons of people on board (everyday citizens, not just the "governement"). Armed citizens can outlast a small group of government leaders, and definitely longer than a few weeks. Not only that, there would be casualties on all sides and foreign states with an agenda assisting all sides. If "elites" had full proof plans, we wouldn't have Syria, Iraq, Vietnam, Venezuela type situations.
These are fake wars, invented for profit.

You've seen what the US is capable of when they want to wipe a population out. But remember, it's 2018 and they'll have much more efficient, complex and destructive technology to do so.
post 1543901771 02-15-2018, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted By CaliSuperSport⏩
All true, but in different scenarios bombs can be far more lethal like McVeigh, and that's one example from hundreds. There's been plenty of cases of spree shootings that resulted in relatively few deaths as well. And teenagers aren't the only profile of spree shooters.

And accessibility to a certain weapon doesn't negate the intent though it may diminish lethality. Inmates make weapons out of toilet paper and jolly ranchers.
Yet the knowledge and forethought into making, placing, detonating a bomb is a significant higher barrier than acquiring a firearm and shooting it. It's just disingenuous to say, oh... if not a firearm, than a bomb. No, because a lot more planning and knowledge has to go into making one and setting it off.
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post 1543902001 02-15-2018, 12:20 PM
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Originally Posted By Lucianus⏩
Conspiracy? The elites haven't built up this enormous wealth and power for John Doe from Bumfuk Nowhere to intimidate them with a gun.

You can say "throughout history" but NEVER has there been a time where they can more easily wipe out massive populations within minutes.

Look what they done to the US troops in Vietnam, treated them like scum. Look what they're doing with their proxy wars in Afghan & Iraq. Obama coming in saying he'll pull everyone out, yet troops still die.

They don't give a chit about you. Threaten their lives and it's game over.
Assuming you're right (and you aren't): if the power structure is that corrupt, even more reason for more gun ownership. Better to have a chance at resistance than none whatsoever.

But hookay. I'm not going to sit here and argue with some conspiracy theory nutcase. Have fun with your tinfoil hat.
post 1543902091 02-15-2018, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted By BigBallsMcgee⏩
this isnt call of duty. Guns are not an equalizer it depends on how your skill level. A lot of people arent good enough to execute under pressure in that kind of situation anyway.

The great equalizer would be nobody has a gun
WHAT? A firearm is a force multiplier. I can pretty much kill a 85 year old lady with my fists... she could not do the same to me, but somehow... you are saying that she can? She must be on "dat dere", right?

And as far as not being an equalizer, then why do police carry them. If no one had a firearm... then do we disarm the police as well?
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post 1543902201 02-15-2018, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted By TunaTunaTuna⏩
Assuming you're right (and you aren't): if the power structure is that corrupt, even more reason for more gun ownership. Better to have a chance at resistance than none whatsoever.

But hookay. I'm not going to sit here and argue with some conspiracy theory nutcase. Have fun with your tinfoil hat.
Once I see evidence that the establishment isn't so corrupt, then I might be more optimistic.

Until then, have a nice weekend brah.

Just remember, you pay the military $600 billion a year (not to mention the unknown funds) don't underestimate them.
post 1543902321 02-15-2018, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted By Lucianus⏩
Nah. I mean guns are for fighting the government, how valuable are bullets when fighting chemical/biological warfare which will be used by the elites?
You watch too much TV.
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post 1543902501 02-15-2018, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted By MiscInformed⏩
You watch too much TV.
I'm observant and not naive.
post 1543903141 02-15-2018, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted By Godyssey⏩
Now compare the population of CA and IL to those mentioned. It's adjusted for population and per. You have no idea how statistics work and I feel bad because you typed all that out but had ZERO IDEA that the stats are adjusted for population. Holy fukk Hahahahahaha
No you fukkwit.

All those states you used in your example of having no restrictions means conservatively >90% of the population is likely armed...closer to 100% in my area in fact..

Is CA or IL even close to the same ratio? I honestly don’t know but would be doubtful...

So despite having far stricter laws and probably fewer guns, your shining examples still lay out more total “gun deaths”

More people? Sure
More guns? Nah
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post 1543903181 02-15-2018, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted By Lucianus⏩
I'm observant and not naive.
You're young and not well informed.

The elites hold political and economic power. That all disappears when civilization collapses. Paper money won't mean a damned thing. Political power is neutered when there is no government. The wealthy elite who run the worldwide banks and the kleptocratic governments that support them, will be bugging out to NZ or some remote part of the planet when the chit hits the fan.
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post 1543903311 02-15-2018, 12:34 PM
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Originally Posted By Tuksonrider⏩
Yet the knowledge and forethought into making, placing, detonating a bomb is a significant higher barrier than acquiring a firearm and shooting it. It's just disingenuous to say, oh... if not a firearm, than a bomb. No, because a lot more planning and knowledge has to go into making one and setting it off.
Personally I disagree that it's disingenuous, because an individual will use tools available to them and have done countless times with any non-firearm homicide. Like I said, lethality may be diminished (or may not in some scenarios as bombs have been many times more lethal) but the intent won't be negated simply because they can only buy a hunting rifle instead of an AR. Unless your stance is against all firearms?
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post 1543903491 02-15-2018, 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted By CaliSuperSport⏩
Unless your stance is against all firearms?
His? No. He's MFC. Definitely not against firearms.
post 1543903671 02-15-2018, 12:37 PM
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LOLed HARD at new thread title.

Well done, sir.
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post 1543903841 02-15-2018, 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted By MiscInformed⏩
You're young and not well informed.

The elites hold political and economic power. That all disappears when civilization collapses. Paper money won't mean a damned thing. Political power is neutered when there is no government. The wealthy elite who run the worldwide banks and the kleptocratic governments that support them, will be bugging out to NZ or some remote part of the planet when the chit hits the fan.
That's what you're lead to believe.

Also, their status goes beyond paper money. It's irrelevant to them. and most of the people you see in public view acting as the elite are doing just that, acting.

Presidents that have a minuscule 4-8 years in "power" evidently don't have any power at all.

The system operated before them and will operate long after their little term ends.
post 1543904521 02-15-2018, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted By CaliSuperSport⏩
Personally I disagree that it's disingenuous, because an individual will use tools available to them and have done countless times with any non-firearm homicide. Like I said, lethality may be diminished (or may not in some scenarios as bombs have been many times more lethal) but the intent won't be negated simply because they can only buy a hunting rifle instead of an AR. Unless your stance is against all firearms?
The intent WOULD be negated because a lot of the times, the use of firearms in such a fashion (mass shootings) is emotionally charged. It's easy to pick up a firearm, and shoot indiscriminately when one is heated up to do so. It is much harder to take the time to build and deploy a bomb. That's days if not weeks in the making. Also, because of buying enough materials over time usually raises red flags.
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post 1543904621 02-15-2018, 12:46 PM
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Originally Posted By STA556⏩
His? No. He's MFC. Definitely not against firearms.
I see. I'm all for effective laws and control, including systems that can monitor at risk individuals. Not just those who have criminal history, but who exhibit erratic or violent behavior in absence of criminal history. I find it odd those who seek the pipe dream of abating every single spree shooting though. Literally impossible as long as firearms exist.
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post 1543904701 02-15-2018, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted By Lucianus⏩
These are fake wars, invented for profit.

You've seen what the US is capable of when they want to wipe a population out. But remember, it's 2018 and they'll have much more efficient, complex and destructive technology to do so.
The loss of Vietnam was not profitable although the war may have been. It was not a fake war, only the motives for getting involved were faked. The Vietnamese were done with being occupied. Vietnam was a colony of French occupation before that war (began as it usually did, with Christian missionaries). In this situation, the elites were western occupiers. The elites did not end well in that war, which began many years before the U.S. became involved. Once the French were expelled, other foreign powers including the U.S. had their mouths dripping with greed for the territory. China and Soviet Union had their own interests and elites that wanted western influence removed from the area. In the end the little people of Vietnam gained their independent state.

You also mention the US military budget. Irrelevant because it doesn't matter how much money you have in that situation (short term), you need the manpower. Unless you fill the military with H1Bs, you aren't going to have an easy time putting down the populace of these united states.
Chaos and apocalypse on us all
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post 1543904741 02-15-2018, 12:48 PM
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Ohhhh

So now they’re saying there were THREE ARMED GUARDS AT THE SCHOOL.

And still... 17 people died.
Truth is out there
post 1543905481 02-15-2018, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted By Tuksonrider⏩
The intent WOULD be negated because a lot of the times, the use of firearms in such a fashion (mass shootings) is emotionally charged. It's easy to pick up a firearm, and shoot indiscriminately when one is heated up to do so. It is much harder to take the time to build and deploy a bomb. That's days if not weeks in the making. Also, because of buying enough materials over time usually raises red flags.
Drastically limited accessibility to firearms by citizens probably would reduce schoolshootingsseeing as many are often legally purchased. At what cost to the general public?

This has limited impact on the use of firearms in every other form of criminal activity which accounts for the majority of firearm related homcide - considering the supply of weapons in our country. Just not clear on what you're suggesting.
Originally Posted By Foxmulder0⏩
Ohhhh

So now they’re saying there were THREE ARMED GUARDS AT THE SCHOOL.

And still... 17 people died.
Sad, but armed guards are just insurance. They aren't magical entities that can stop bullets with their mind.

It sounds like the security guard who encountered the shooter was unarmed and killed.
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post 1543905701 02-15-2018, 01:01 PM
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These trappers and rappers own a gun and rap about it in their music, no one bats an eye. Kid shoots up school time after time after time after time, ban guns
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post 1543905881 02-15-2018, 01:04 PM
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#1170
  1. KramericaInd
  2. Banned
  1. KramericaInd
  2. Banned
  3. Join Date: Feb 2014
  4. Location: United States
  5. Posts: 9,894
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Originally Posted By HoustonMiscer⏩
These trappers and rappers own a gun and rap about it in their music, no one bats an eye. Kid shoots up school time after time after time after time, ban guns
racist, heathen, degenerate get with the times, its just an artistic expression, emotional distress, reparations, etc
Originally Posted By MiscInformed⏩
You're young and not well informed.

The elites hold political and economic power. That all disappears when civilization collapses. Paper money won't mean a damned thing. Political power is neutered when there is no government. The wealthy elite who run the worldwide banks and the kleptocratic governments that support them, will be bugging out to NZ or some remote part of the planet when the chit hits the fan.
geez, what 4chan subthread did you come crawling out of?
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